Have you ever wondered how a young entrepreneur navigates the building trade? Join me as I sit down with Michael Carroll, the mind behind Signature Building Co., to uncover his journey as a newly fledged builder.
Our conversation is a treasure trove of insights into the intricacies of the building trade. We talk about the irreplaceable value of having a solid contract, protecting you from scope changes and exploitation. We also delve into the financial burdens, from the investment in tools to other overlooked elements that pile up. But there's more. Ever thought about the challenges of engaging with large volume builders? Michael shares his firsthand experiences and offers advice for aspiring builders on how to thrive amidst these trials.
We further explore the enriching journey of apprenticeship, discussing how to create a conducive learning environment while ensuring safety and support. Michael sheds light on the importance of mentoring and coaching, a testament to his resolve to drive his business to newer heights. From standing up for your rights, learning the ropes of professionalism, to business development tips, our chat with Michael is an illuminating guide for anyone in the building industry. Don't miss this episode where we build bridges with business wisdom.
check out Michael's work here...
signaturebuildingco.com.au
We're on a mission to elevate the professionalism of the residential construction industry, and help everyone enjoy building and renovating homes.
Easy to use Quoting software for Builders. Produce professional and accurate proposals. Quickly and accurately measure and markup plans in minutes. Win more jobs and track costs. 21 Day Free Trial.
check out more podcasts here...
https://levelupwithduaynepearce.buzzsprout.com
Have you ever wondered how a young entrepreneur navigates the building trade? Join me as I sit down with Michael Carroll, the mind behind Signature Building Co., to uncover his journey as a newly fledged builder.
Our conversation is a treasure trove of insights into the intricacies of the building trade. We talk about the irreplaceable value of having a solid contract, protecting you from scope changes and exploitation. We also delve into the financial burdens, from the investment in tools to other overlooked elements that pile up. But there's more. Ever thought about the challenges of engaging with large volume builders? Michael shares his firsthand experiences and offers advice for aspiring builders on how to thrive amidst these trials.
We further explore the enriching journey of apprenticeship, discussing how to create a conducive learning environment while ensuring safety and support. Michael sheds light on the importance of mentoring and coaching, a testament to his resolve to drive his business to newer heights. From standing up for your rights, learning the ropes of professionalism, to business development tips, our chat with Michael is an illuminating guide for anyone in the building industry. Don't miss this episode where we build bridges with business wisdom.
check out Michael's work here...
signaturebuildingco.com.au
We're on a mission to elevate the professionalism of the residential construction industry, and help everyone enjoy building and renovating homes.
Easy to use Quoting software for Builders. Produce professional and accurate proposals. Quickly and accurately measure and markup plans in minutes. Win more jobs and track costs. 21 Day Free Trial.
check out more podcasts here...
https://levelupwithduaynepearce.buzzsprout.com
So it's not their fault that they stuffed it up. What did you do wrong as the boss to not set them up for success? If you keep blaming them, you know nothing's gonna change ["Battle of the Shed"].
Speaker 2:Good day guys. Welcome back to another episode of Level Up. We are back in the shed this afternoon and, as you'll hear through this episode, it's a real building show today, because we got a lot of building work going on literally just outside the shed. So, uh, I apologize for all the noise. Um, oh, I love it. I think it's uh, some people pay for sound effects like this and we're getting it for free. This is gonna be another cracking episode today, Um, and I'm quite uh thrilled, or excited, to see where this one's gonna go. The young fellow we've got on the show today uh, has been in business since 2019. Actually contacted me through social media probably 12, 18 months ago now, I'd assume.
Speaker 1:It was a wallbuck, yeah.
Speaker 2:And he's actually flown up here today from Melbourne, uh, and he's in Brisbane for an awards night with a coaching company that he's currently working with, which I'm super keen to get into and talk about more. But one of his proudest moments so far is getting his builders license, and I know this is gonna be a great check when I get on because, uh, he loves ACDC cultures of Van Halen, guns N' Roses, monster truck speedboats and all the uh camping and outdoors shit, the same, uh same stuff that I'm all about. So, big warm welcome to uh Michael from Signature Building Co. How are you, mate? Good mate, thanks for having me.
Speaker 2:Mate, thanks for um taking the time out while you're up here in Brisy to jump on and have a chat with us. Yeah, not a problem, mate, I'm uh keen to see how this goes. Yeah, I find this awesome because you're only 26 years old, is that right? Yeah, yeah, and you're already investing time and money into coaching and mentoring and stuff. So you've reached out to me online quite a few times about, like, as you move on jumping on board with LiveLiveBuild and elevating stuff, but your most of your business at the moment is contract carpentry work. Mate, I'll take my hat off to you For someone of your age and your position to see the value in spending, uh, money and time on yourself like I just think that's huge.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, look to be honest, it sort of all came out of desperation. To be honest, I was, um, right on the verge of throwing the towel in on uh, doing this anymore, because I just it was like just all coming to a head like I wasn't making any money and and just stressed out and just over it in general. So I was like I got to do something different. And you know, doing some poke around online talking to a few different guys, I said you know, you've got to get a coach on board.
Speaker 2:So so where what's your background? Like, where have you come from? Like, is your family in the, in the industry or Nothing.
Speaker 1:My parents couldn't be the furthest thing from being in the trade at all. My old boy is in IT and mum's in disability, so, yeah, furthest thing from it. My father was an engineer for the Shell Company, so that might be something. But, um, you know, it's sort of coming out of school. So I sort of was like I did a pre-app, you know, while I was at school and I was like, yeah, wouldn't mind doing some sort of trade. But you know, as school sort of wound up, I was like to mum, yeah, wouldn't mind taking a gap year, you know, and she goes, I'll be. You know, you're not taking a gap year, there's no way yeah.
Speaker 1:If you don't have a job, you're not in this house anymore. So that sort of pushed me into gear to get the apprenticeship going and yeah, so you've done your trade as a carpenter. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so how long since you finished your time?
Speaker 1:Well, funny enough, I actually finished up my time and went straight out on my own. So it was. It was sort of one of those things. My boss sort of pushed us out the door. He had a couple of qualifiers and he sort of wanted to wind back what he was doing, get rid of the qualifiers, just keep apprentices. And he had two other guys. One of them had been out of his time for probably two or three years and he said, well, why don't you two, you know, start something partnership and I'll give you the contacts and just go start smashing out some frames and make some money? So yeah, that's what we did. We just sort of wound up and I learned I hate. I hate more than I ever learned in my apprenticeship in that first year out, that's for sure.
Speaker 2:So you've got a partner in Signature, not anymore.
Speaker 1:So yeah, so we used to have a company called JNM Built and we ran that for we've got four years out now, so we did it for three Signature Build is only one year old now. Partnerships are hard deals, aren't they? Oh mate, it was really hard trying to, you know, keep the balance of. We started the business thinking we could have a bit of work-life balance and that never happened, you know, and yeah, it was hard work but it was also good to have someone there to bounce everything off.
Speaker 2:When they work they're magic. But yeah, just, it's really hard finding partners that you can really gel with and have yeah, get on. And I guess, being the other thing, the hard thing about partners is finding a partner that you can bounce ideas off without the other one getting the shits.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah. Well, that's sort of what happened in the end. Not anything bad, but you know, I was like going I think I want to be a builder. He's going. Well, you know, I don't know if I really want to do that you know, so that sort of was a bit of tension.
Speaker 2:So how long have you like? So what point did you start looking for coaching? Was that when you were with your business partner, or yes, so as he wound up and left the business.
Speaker 1:It was about then when it all sort of started to come to a head for me, where I was like a lot more work now, because I used to do a lot of the book stuff and dealing with supervisors and stuff so I could answer the phone, and now I'm trying to manage all these guys and be on the phone and fix problems and whatever else. So it sort of all came to a head and that's where I was like yeah, I need to do something different for sure.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so the coaching stuff you've been doing, it's a who's the company you've been doing it with.
Speaker 1:So it's with ProTrade United. It's a 12 month course, so started in September and winding up in September.
Speaker 2:So Like what's the cover, like what sort of stuff are you doing in the program?
Speaker 1:Sort of everything. It's very blanket course. It's trade specific. They don't allow any, just any business to walk into it. But it's about, you know, quoting jobs right, managing your team, creating cultures. They have this thing called the business mountain and basically, as the mountain progresses, it's sort of the more base camps you have to get to before you get up the mountain. It's sort of those foundation, you know, base camps that you have to have to build to a business that's at the top of the mountain.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, it's important stuff and that's an awesome structure. I'm sure just that in itself has probably been an eye open for you to see that you have to have all these structures to ultimately get to a point where you have a bit of freedom and you work like balance and stuff Like I think a lot of people don't get this like freedom, success, money in your bank, like all this stuff. Goals don't come without having structure?
Speaker 1:No, definitely not, definitely not, and we had none, like we had no structure at all, and it's still a long way to go, but I feel like in the 12 months it's, we've definitely propelled massively from where we were.
Speaker 2:So have you been like? So you got to a point where you realized you wanted, you needed to get some help to progress in your business. Like, have you, are you still doing similar work now to what you were then, but you've been able to have a professional business by still doing that same work? Or have you had to get rid of some work, or what's the story behind that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, we had to look at, definitely, the builders we were contracting to, you know, were they aligning with where we want to be, which was a hard thing to do? That's important, isn't it? Well, it just makes your life so much difficult If, like, if no one wants to help you and they supervise you. It's like, you know, because we were doing a lot of really sort of first homebuy stuff, so we sort of went through an evolution, so we went first homebuy, then we moved up to sort of your higher end volume, went into some real custom stuff, then came back to that high end, and then I was like, at the end of last year I was like I might try the volume stuff again. Now I've got these boys that are quite experienced. Maybe I'll try the volume stuff, we can just pump out some volume stuff. And that was the worst decision I ever made, because these first-time supervisors didn't care about me, didn't care about how much money I was making. They couldn't even answer their phone most of the time. Yeah, so that really killed me for sure.
Speaker 2:So I'm pretty curious to find out from a young bloke like yourself because I know when I was your age and had a big, large carpenter gang and smashed your heaps of work, like I was pretty slack on the contract side of things. Like have you got contracts in place with the builders you're working with?
Speaker 1:No, there's no contracts. We just get handed a PO. This is how much you're getting paid for the job. It's the scope of work you have to do inside of that and you just go and do it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so how does it get dealt with if other stuff comes up? Or like, how do you stick to that scope?
Speaker 1:of work. You just got to do it because they're just going to call you back, and call you back, and call you back if you don't have QA processes and make sure that everything that is on that PO is getting done. Yeah. You're just going to get called back a million times and then any profit you did make in that slim margin is just gone. Yeah, you know you're not going to have that.
Speaker 2:I guess some advice from my experience and, like I said, I was in your position, like I did it for years You've got to kick back and or push back and like, if they don't have contracts, you need to have a contract that you get them to sign. Like everything comes back to your documentation and I think, like for a young bloke like yourself moving forward, like take the time and effort, like develop Well, you can probably get them off the shelf even. But like, come up with a contract that you can let. Like, if they give you a scope of works, just put that into a contract, but have something that you're actually getting them to sign off on. Because I actually think it's.
Speaker 2:It's a really shitty part of the industry. Because I feel sorry for guys like yourself, because I know there's builders out there that rely on not having documentation and contracts, with their subbies and everybody, and I know like it gets you in a hard situation because you get you start feeling like, well, I've got to go back and do that, otherwise they're not going to pay me for all the work they've already done. So you end up doing more work to get money that you've already earned, yeah, and then you're out of pocket because you've spent more time than what you should have spent.
Speaker 1:And you end up doing it to keep the supervisor on side, so that all those things in good faith do end up getting paid as well, like it's just, it's a terrible part of the industry. I think it needs to go, for sure.
Speaker 2:I'm a huge fan now of you've got to take responsibility for the situations you put yourself in. So you either got to look at working with other builders and stop working for those builders, all yeah. You've got to take it into your own hands and say, hey, mate, look I'm I'm happy to keep doing your work. But, moving forward, I've actually come up with this contract and before I start any work on site, we're going to have to sign this off before I do anything. And then you're actually taking control and and you can put everything in there. You can put your payment terms like all sorts of things if you need progress draws. So you really take the responsibility. And once you've got a contract, look, there's still going to be probably guys out there that might try and push you and take advantage or not still want to pay, but you've got a contract. Yeah.
Speaker 2:You've actually got a document that, if push comes to shove, you can. You've got a leg to stand on. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:I can definitely see value in it, for sure. It's just I'd be interested to see how it actually is played off in reality with these guys, because it's very much one of those things where it's like either you do it or you don't.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and they've not been in your shoes, like that honestly, like we, when I had heaps of, like I know, at our peak, 40, 50 odd carboners and like I remember there was a few volume builders that back in the day we really like they just loved how organized I was and how I had a great team and I pushed everyone along and like I remember we would go into streets and I think the most we ever did I think it was like eight or nine side by side and so it was so easy. I made it so easy for the supervisors. Like we just turned up, had big crews, like we literally just bang, bang, bang, bang bang, like all their trades would follow behind us, like I was making them money and I was busting my balls to make that he ten dollars. That's it but.
Speaker 2:I was in that situation heaps of times. I remember a couple clear eyes, like where supervisors would miss variation that a client had discussed with the builder and they hadn't provided us with the correct set of drawings or whatever. And then all of a sudden, it's on us to be like their hand and us to go back and change a swinging door to a cavity, sliding door or whatever it may be. And I went mate, I've finished that job. Like, hurry up and pay me, like I've done what was on the plans you gave me. Oh, no, no, look, we can't pay until you come back and make this change.
Speaker 2:Well, that fucking change wasn't on the drawings, like, and it just, it just goes around in circles. Yeah and yeah, knowing what I know now, that's the best advice I can give yourself and any young or any carboners in your position. Like, you've got to push back on the builders, because these volume builders, mate, they will keep taking advantage for as long as they possibly can and, look, you might have to walk away from doing their work because, on the other, the flip side of that is there's a shitload of builders out there that want to run good businesses and do the right thing and build good relationships.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, and that's one of those things. You know, we, when I started the business, was one job in particular, for everyone would know the builder. But we, we did a heap of work that was outside of our scope, things like installing the structural steel because they couldn't get a steel fixer to come and do it, all different things. Oh, yeah, yeah, we'll pay you, we'll pay you, we'll pay you to the tune of four grand. And then in the end there was there was no money.
Speaker 2:We know.
Speaker 1:And we should have. I should have known. I knew that I should have had a PO in my hand before I did the job, but did the task. But when you're expensive lesson isn't it? Well, when you're in the thick of it and it's like, well, you've got two options you either put the steel up or you get delayed on this job, and then there's nothing else for you to do, or, you know, you've got to run around and find other work. You end up going well, it looks like we're putting that steel up, aren't we, you know?
Speaker 2:I mean, look, I think this flows through to not just young guys like yourself, but like all trades and even myself as a builder, like you. It is a. It is a tricky situation to navigate when you're in a position where you like I'm sure you know different to me you take it quite personally that you've got a team and you've got to keep them paid every week.
Speaker 2:They've got bills and family to look after and all those types of things and it can be hard to like have make that decision. Well, I'm just going to have to walk off the job, yeah. But you feel like you're doing the right thing because you're like, oh, I got to keep, I just got to keep the boys working, and in the end you're, you're the only one like us, as a bosses, we're the only ones that lose out, because I'm sure if you're anything like me, you still pay your team, and then you have to go and fight with the builder or the homeowner or whatever it is, to get paid.
Speaker 1:Well, that's the end. The boss gets paid last, isn't it? That's the reality. And actually I was listening to that latest podcast you had out and then you made a really great point about you know it always works out in the end. You know you're really stressing about what's going to happen if I do walk off this job. I've got no other work. But you know, every now I reflect back on every time we've been in a position like that and it just works out in the end. You know I mean it.
Speaker 2:Just it just doesn't work out. Like it's what you put out there, everyone thinks like I was the same. I used to think this was all bloody airy fairies. But what you put out to the universe comes back and I am a massive believer now that the situations you put yourself in, you'll, you'll keep continuing to get in those situations if you keep accepting that that position you're in. So if you keep taking on work with out purchase orders or without contracts, you're just going to end up back in that same situation all the time. That's the hamster wheel that we all get stuck on. So you put out to the universal no stuff this like there's no purchase order.
Speaker 2:Mate, I mean my team, we're out here we're going to work for a bill that that will give me a contract, you'll start to look at it. It just happens that you just start to attract the right people.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the right people. That's it. That's the same thing with being a builder, you know, attracting the right customers as well. You know, you put yourself out there as that really professional business, then you're already leaps and bounds in front Trying to find those ideal customers.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, look, I think it's. I've sort of come to the conclusion now, like I used to butt my head against the wall and get so frustrated about our industry and that it's everybody else's fault and that things will never change. And that's what's got to where it is now, with the live, life, build and qualities in my building business and doing this podcast. Like I'm creating a new industry now and we're we're creating our own, I guess, environment. Like we're attracting the right people trades, builders like, people like yourself, like reaching out, come on this podcast, tell your story, because your story, like this podcast we're doing right now, is going to resonate with who knows hundreds of other people, thousands of other people in the industry and slowly, through these stories, those builders that are running those shit shows that aren't given purchase orders are getting people to do work and they're not paying them. They're not going to be able to do it, mate, because everyone out there is going to be on work for them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's it isn't it. Yeah, it is.
Speaker 2:Like the reality is. It is a small world, so I've learnt that massively.
Speaker 1:You know, it's always funny. It's probably very similar all over Australia, but in Melbourne someone knows someone. Oh, this Chibi's work for that builder. That builder I don't work for him because my mate got burnt by it. You know, it's funny how small the industry is. You know, and now that I'm doing a lot more networking with you know key players in the industry and stuff, you know oh, yeah, I know them. Yeah, we work with them. Yeah, it's crazy how small it really is.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So with this, the coaching stuff that you're doing, do they touch on contracts and what you should be doing, Like, because if it's all trade based, they should. I would imagine they should be teaching some contractual stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's contract stuff in there. It's more from a builder point of view. You know, signing a HIO contract or your master builders whatever you're sort of with not really anything for the trade specifically. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I mean, look, I hope. If there's one thing you can take away from this podcast, or any of the 10, 15 minutes in, is either find an industry, one that you can use, or create your own. Like, make sure you've got contracts and don't continue Like I know it's hard when you're on site doing the framing and the structural. The structural still is part of what you need to, especially if it's two story like you need beams and shit to be able to do your second story.
Speaker 2:Like I feel for you, Like you get in those situations and you like, fuck it, I'll just like if I don't do it, I can't continue with my frame and then I'm not going to get my drawer and I'm not going to get money in the bank to pay my team. Yeah.
Speaker 1:It's a vicious cycle, you know, and you end up always back on the schedule thing. Yeah, you know if I have to push them, whichever supplier it may be, trust supplier or whoever to do on a delivery, we're never going to be two weeks out. Yeah, you know, it's just, it's so are you doing work for multiple builders? Yeah, yeah, we sort of work for your big three still currently, and then we serve as a couple of small custom home builders and a couple of smaller still volume but high end volume builders as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm more keen to know, just from my own curiosity, to see how much it's changed since I was doing this type of work. Like what's their payment terms, like the?
Speaker 1:big three are really good. I think they have to be. Yeah, seven days.
Speaker 1:So that's that is good, yeah, but it's sort of it's a weird one, cause you have to be ticked off by the supervisor on a certain day to be getting that payment the next week and if they miss it then you get pushed out two weeks. So is that? But you know, still a lot of the smaller builders, a lot of the custom home guys are still on two weeks, but I think for volume they have to be seven days. They've got to be.
Speaker 2:When I was doing volume stuff it was not unusual to go Well, most standard was pretty much 30 days or 45 days, and it was definitely not unusual to go 60 and 90 days yeah no, you can't happen that, yeah, it was.
Speaker 2:It was shocker, mate, like the money when I got up to that point where we had, yeah, 40, 50 carpenters. Like the money I had to have available to feed the business like while I was waiting on hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars from multiple different builders was huge, like. I think so many people don't understand that behind the scene stuff like that goes on. Like there's a lot of money get like. Especially if you're paying your boys weekly, the money gets chewed up pretty quickly.
Speaker 1:And all the other stuff that comes along with running a business. You know your insurances and just I can go to Total Tools and play with 1000 bucks like that without even thinking about it.
Speaker 2:So 10, like 20.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly, however, much you want to depends what you buy and you know just to run the business you will need nails and whatever else. You just 1000 bucks, no worries.
Speaker 2:Actually, this is a. This is probably a good topic. I actually think it's. I don't know if it's something we've touched on too much in this podcast, but like you're a good exam because you're in it right now. Look how much do you reckon your your trial is worth?
Speaker 1:100 grand 150 grand, I wouldn't be 150 years.
Speaker 2:Probably it'd be 50, I reckon I wouldn't you think about how much your tools are worth and like everything in there, Like it doesn't take much to get up to 100 grand yeah yeah, that's true, but you look at, I think about this quite a bit like clients, and especially this is more so for the tradey guys.
Speaker 2:But like clients, whatever you're doing, if you're a plumber or a sparky rocking up to do a call out, or all your, all your carbon to go into a frame for another builder or build a deck for a client, whatever the case is but they get so focused on, let's say, like the call out fee, it's whatever 100 bucks an hour. Or you're trying to frame up for a builder and it's nine grand or whatever. No one takes into consideration that over your career you've had to, like you, drag your office behind your youth, or these days most people have canopies or vans or whatever, but it is not like.
Speaker 2:I guarantee you it would not be hard and I think you'd be surprised you added up I reckon most good chipies out there would have 80 to 150 grand with the tools to be able to do the job that they do, especially when you start talking about specialized tools as well.
Speaker 1:You know like set out lasers and table saws and and.
Speaker 2:Made a decent like. Well, a decent, let's say like a Milwaukee pack out kit these days I had eight or 10 tools in it, like they're. They're tools for you, right? And then you? Then you like your nail guns are what are they? And now? A grand or two hundred bucks each and you might have multiple of them and then your drop sores a couple of grand like then all that's up. And then like ladders and planks and trestles and lasers, like it's huge yeah.
Speaker 2:And that's all. It's all getting carted around on your back like a bloody turtle job to job and you need it on.
Speaker 1:you need all of them all the time as well. Like you can't afford not to have it in the trailer, because at one time you do need it, you're guaranteed not to have it.
Speaker 2:I know like I find this strange because, like everything, it's a throwaway world these days which really shits me. But like back in the day when I was an apprentice and through my early days in my career, like there was multiple people around that like you actually booked them to come to site and like you got your tool service. So with this one guy, Kevin Sharpen it like he, he would like my boss. He was like you had to book him months in advance. My boss used him and I started my own. I started using him and like he would literally turn up to site and we had the leather cases. So like you would have four, five, six hand saws in a case You'd have. Like when I had hits of chip is like it wasn't uncommon for me to have 30 or 40 saw blades in leather cases, so he would come to site and sharpen all your blades.
Speaker 1:Unheard of now, mate.
Speaker 3:Now it's just throwaway, just throw it out you buy a handle for what do you buy?
Speaker 2:a handle for Seven bucks.
Speaker 1:Nothing.
Speaker 2:Yeah and yeah. And then the nail guns that we obviously all had the. I still push my team to use the air tools. I think they're the way to go, but get the decencos out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we all had guns because you were carrying a four kilo gun around all day, every day. But like, yes, he was the same, he'd come out to site and like I had, I couldn't even tell you how many now it had. Like I know, when I was a prince I worked my boss. I hit about eight nail guns. I actually know that was framers. And then he I think we had five or six finish finishes, we had multiple tea nailers. So yeah, there's probably an arsenal of 20 odd guns and yeah, so this other guy would come out and pull him apart on site and check, like change of pistons, the O rings. Like that'd be unreal. I don't even know if that exists anymore.
Speaker 1:I don't know about it. There is a few small tool shops like. We work with one. That's fantastic and they can turn tools around within a few hours. Yeah, you know. So. Even now I'm out in drill and I'll travel the you know the hour and a half to go take them there, because you can't beat that turnaround time.
Speaker 2:So how does it work with your stuff? Look, there's a bill to say to you hey, this frame here is seventy seven hundred bucks.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so you'll get the PO, whatever its amount is, and they'll supply all the timber or your hardware. You just got to bring nails and coils, let's say the frame, nails and coils. You might have to supply specific screws to screw down the floor with, but for the most part they're supplying everything. But you end up buying a whole lot of miscellaneous stuff, you know triples here and there or whatever, just to be able to have it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because they never supply enough, but is that at worst? So they say this this is the price to do that frame.
Speaker 3:And you just have to get it done as quick as you can and you make whatever's left.
Speaker 2:Yep, pretty much, yeah, pretty much. It just blows my mind that it hasn't changed a lot since 20 or 18 years ago, when I was doing that, like we, you basically got a hand of a set of drawings and you had to smash it up Like there was no, this price for this price you need to do and that's what I'm saying Like I, knowing what I know now and where I've come from and what I do with my trades like, mate, if you're, if the bills you're working for aren't doing it, I'd be giving it back to them and saying, all right, well, I'll do that job for whatever eight or nine grand, but and this is what I'm doing so well, they stick frames or pre now trains.
Speaker 1:It's all over. It depends which ones you work for. A lot of them were pre fab. Then our stick Start and swing back the other way.
Speaker 2:now back to pre fab, yeah so give them, give them as much detail as you can Like, so I would. I would be providing them the same scope that I pretty much give my clients now in our proposal. So, mate, you could jump on with Quote ease, I can set you up a template. But, like again, this is just advice. But if I was you and they're saying, hey, this frame is going to be this much, I would be saying, all right, well, I accept that and this is what I'm doing for that.
Speaker 2:And it would be as detailed as check the slab for square flicker, market the slab. Cut and prepare all the timber, erect all the timber framing, plum and straighten ready for trusses. A complete, all time down as per engineering. Install all roof trusses, complete all the tight end on the roof trusses. It would be literally be a list of probably two dozen line items and if it changes from that, as a very, as a variation, and that, look, this is probably where these volume builders are at.
Speaker 1:They really and I've noticed this they want guys that don't know any better 100%. They want guys that don't know that 100% because they want the fresh out of their time. Guys that don't know any better.
Speaker 2:100% well look to a certain extent, but they also make. They're going into the like these volume builders and well, not just volume builders. Most builders are working on the thinnest margins and most builders, like I'm a firm believer and most bills are trading in solvent. So, like you just said, they rely on you not kicking back and being like knowing that you need their paycheck. So if they ask you for a few variations, you got no choice. You're just going to keep like they'll just keep feeding you along, like I hear it. I hear so many stories now People reaching out to me on socials, particularly with the big commercial guys and like stories of where they've completely finished all their works and the client for the commercial builders request a variation. The commercial builder just expects them to do it, even though they're charging a variation for it.
Speaker 2:And then basically says oh look, if you want the next job, you got to do it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and that's the. That's the funny thing as well with you know. Let's just say these volume builders. They've got their floor plans and the client wants to make a change from a swinging opening door to a cavity slider. They charge them. And I know this because I just built a volume builder house for myself and they charged us $1,700 to change that door to a calf slider. The Chibi didn't get paid anymore to put the calf slider unit in. Yeah, the frame mob didn't get paid anymore to make it a calf slider opening. You know, so they're just, they're just grabbing that money and not paying anything more for it.
Speaker 2:Like in there to fence. They're covering their overheads, they're paying the whatever. It is $270 for a cavity sliding door frame, but there has to be money in that variation to pay the carpenter to install it. And it's not just installing the cavity frame. It takes longer to install a cavity door at Fido app than it does a swinging door. Yeah, mate, you guys have got to kick back Like mate. I think it's. I honestly think it's.
Speaker 2:I could use a lot of explicit words to describe how it is but I think the thing is about like young guys like yourself, I guess, being vulnerable enough to come here today and talk to me and put your hand up and take advice and like. Hopefully, you like. I hope you go away from this podcast and don't sleep for the next two nights and holy shit.
Speaker 2:Like he's right, I need to get this, this and this and cause mate, it's only going to make you a better business and a more profitable business and a more successful business, and it'd be good to get your insight on this, cause I know it really gets you down, doesn't it, when you're in that situation where you know you've done what you're supposed to do, you know you shouldn't have to do anymore, but you need that check. And the only way for you to get that check is to do a bit more work. And you know, once you've done that bit more work, you're going to make even less out of that job. But if you want the paycheck, you've got to get it done, yeah.
Speaker 1:And that you're just at their mercy for 100%. You know, for exactly what you just said you just at their mercy to get that money. If they call you back, I need you to come do this, and that's the other thing. Well, you know, if something is missed, it's never just one return trip, it's never just why. Oh, we'll get you back once, we'll get you to do the windows, and if you miss this, we'll get you to do that as well. Yeah, it's always. I need you here right now to do this because the brick is starting or whatever. Oh, but I don't have the material for you to do that stuff you missed. So you have to come back and do that, but get those windows in because the brick is going to start. So, ok, you go back and put the windows in, but then there's another return trip.
Speaker 2:But there's good stuff to be talking about. So this comes down to the supervision of the jobs and, like most volume builders and look, I'm sure there's a lot of great ones out there and there are I know, when I was doing the same shit you're doing now, like there was some supervisors that made just they. They were not. I could think of a lot of names but they weren't even the laborer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like, yeah, and it used to shit me exactly what you just said. I'd forgotten about that. But, yeah, same deal, like and that's a great explanation Like the brick is there, throw on the windows in and you might I don't know have to get something set up for this defeats or or do something for the internal roughen or whatever it may be, and you could save some time and money and get it done at the same time. But the supervisor only thought about the bricky. So, yeah, you have to end up doing multiple trips because of their lack of bloody experience.
Speaker 1:So it's in and it's scary as well. I've worked with some guys who, some supervisors who don't even have a trade background. They've got no trade under their belt, so how do they even know what's going on? Yeah, you know, and they're the worst to work for, but again, like I just said, I have seen some absolutely unbelievable supervisors there are.
Speaker 2:Do you build relationships with these guys? Because obviously the better relationship you can have with them, and the more they help you out, the better you're going to do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's a few guys that you know. They've moved from builder to builder and we follow with them because you know, I know what. I just like to work for this guy and, regardless of where he's working at, I know how he's going to operate and they're always looking after you as well, which is just unreal.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so Matt is it. Is it what it's cracked out to be? Like you like jump and finish your apprenticeship and jump and end it.
Speaker 1:There's easier ways to make quit. I reckon that's for sure. That's for sure.
Speaker 2:Well, I think you're made for, I think you've got to give yourself some credit because you've taken that, you're getting some training and, like I said at your age, like if you can continue that training and that growth like this is probably like I don't. I don't dwell on things anymore. I reflect a lot and I believe that I wouldn't appreciate the situation I mean now as much if I hadn't been through all the shit and hard times that I did. My only regret is that it took me so many cycles to get to this point where I was like fuck it, like something has to change. So, yeah, I take my hat off to you, like getting in some train now. Like my advice is don't back off. Like just whatever change you have put it into yourself, like improve yourself, Like learn how to run the business and just keep it going.
Speaker 1:And it's paid off tenfold. You know like, and it really does. It comes back more times and you'll. The initial outlay was nothing compared to what is, you know, your make or save later on. It's. It's been just crazy and just even just as a business, as a person, how different you are after doing it. It's unbelievable.
Speaker 2:That's it's. It's incredible, isn't it, how a lot of people think they need some coaching or mentoring because of the business side of things, but, like you just said, you actually end up finding out that it's. It's a lot of personal stuff. Yeah, it's made me a better leader, for sure.
Speaker 1:You know, like I always go back to times where you know you'd get yelled at for something and you just go. Well, it just makes you hate the boss or whoever. You know you don't have to yell at people to influence them. You know you can do a lot more by just talking to them.
Speaker 2:But what, what? What are you doing? Your team like how do you treat?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I try to treat the boys like they're, like they're qualified, because I think that's full of shit when you've got you know. I know there's a bit of a hazing or whatever. They've got to get through as an apprentice.
Speaker 2:But so what's your team look like? At the moment.
Speaker 1:So right now I've got two apprentices one is a first year, one's a second year and actually super young. So the first year is 16 and the the second year. I got in when he was 17. So Ken has mastered, just rip in. It's there.
Speaker 2:They're actually pretty good, pretty good blokes yeah yeah, because you're saying you had a larger team and then true coven, that you've had to get rid of some tradies.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, I had a couple of qualifiers. And you know, is that old age, old thing where you're like, yeah, I wouldn't mind. You know, get a couple more people, more hands, quicker work gets done, make more money. But in reality you don't actually make more money when something falls over Not when you're in a structure, shit no no, nothing to fall back on to. You know, when something falls over you just hemorrhage.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. When there's no structure there, it doesn't matter how many people or how good your turnover is like, it just means you're putting out more fires, you're losing more time, you're more stressed, so you are really less sleep. It all turns to shit pretty.
Speaker 1:It just turns to shit quicker, yeah yeah, and that you know, don't get me wrong. It's also hard just having the two of them from having a big crew and you go from a large crew to a small crew. It's a massive change and even things like when I put that day aside to do coaching, it is a logistically a hard day.
Speaker 2:So how do you go about that? Because I think this is really good to talk about, because there'd be a lot of people in your position that aren't like no, they need to do something, but they're not, because they're stuck in this position and like, well, how can I leave sight? Like what you?
Speaker 1:just got to let go of the reins, really, you know. So what do?
Speaker 2:you or two young guys do Like. If they're only apprentices, what do they do the day you was?
Speaker 1:Well, so now I've got my house. They do a lot of work around my house, which is good, but where you can leave them to do things you can, you know, but you can't. You can't leave them on a frame and expect them to stand up walls and get it right, you know you're just going to ask for dramas. So you've got to pick your battles 100 percent. But there's also the part where you shouldn't be leaving them alone.
Speaker 2:So do you, does your schedule, do you work that in? There Like, if you know that whatever day or week you're working on yourself and your business like does, does the job work around?
Speaker 1:that, yeah, yeah, 100 percent. I mean, truth be told, I had coaching Tuesday that I wasn't able to go to because it just all went to crap. But yeah, normally I've put all the dates in. You know well and truly ahead, and then, as the jobs get scheduled, you just leave that space in there, you know, and like you've got to give the boys days to do their schoolwork as well. So a lot of the time they do that as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think it's like it can be a tricky one and I know, look, I often think back to like the years where, like we we've put through you can even tell you how many apprentices over the years and like I was just I'd just scream like I used to call them young and I'd be on site and I'd be up on scaffold or up on a roof and I'd just be screaming young and like, where are you? Like, where's that piece of? Timber Like have you cut that yet?
Speaker 2:And I think back like there's definitely ways I could have dealt with things better. But I guess, as I've progressed and got better and definitely as becoming a builder and I'm very open with my team now, like everybody has to learn and I think the one thing I've definitely learned and I look back, like my one of my bosses in particular, like at the time I just thought was an absolute prick.
Speaker 2:Well actually probably a couple of my bosses. I thought at the time were pricks, but they just drove me like a dog. They expected so much and look, it made me who I am now. But with my team now I'm very open and just tell them like I don't care if the young, like the younger guys, make mistakes, so if if they stuff something out, they cut it wrong, like it's going to cost us a bit of money here and there, but I'll get the shits if they do it multiple times. But sometimes I firmly believe now the best way for people to learn is to be left on their own.
Speaker 2:Obviously make sure they're safe, they know to use the tools and those types of things, but throwing people in the deep end and saying, hey, like an apprentice, like mate, just go and hang those doors. Like, have a crack, have a go, you'll learn more from you'll learn more from having to fix your mistakes and see what you've done wrong than you will from weeks of someone standing beside you holding your hand, showing you every single little thing.
Speaker 1:Today, and I mean with coaching, we. It's a big concept and I don't have my head around it completely yet, but that piece about total responsibility, you know, so it's not their fault that they stuffed it up. What? What did you do wrong as the boss to not set them up for success? It was like a training. You know the wrong tools was. You know what? Was it that?
Speaker 2:if you keep blaming them, you know total responsibility is one of the most powerful things you can have as a business owner. Like it doesn't matter what business you have, like you are. If you view everything as it's your responsibility and take ownership for it, the flow and effect of your team is huge. So, yeah, it gives them permission to take ownership of things. Like if you're throwing your hands in the air and screaming all the time and going off at them for making mistakes and things like that, that doesn't help anybody out and I think that's a big one in life as well. Like you've got to take ownership. So how do you, what type of things do you like? What happens in your business for you to make you realise that?
Speaker 1:I mean, we've had all those sort of stuff ups, you know, cutting the timber wrong or whatever it may have been. And yeah, at the end of the day, just like I said, I haven't got my head around it completely yet. The concept I'm still working on it. But just, you know, trying to be open to the idea of, you know, not blaming them, and especially if you've got a call of supervisors about something major, you know, I've seen guys that instantly go oh the boys you know stuffed this up.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, you just look like a dickhead when you say that, yeah, I mean I look, I'll put my hand up. I was, I definitely said that back in the day. Oh, the boys have fucked that up. You need to, you need to order some more timber or whatever. But whereas now I'd say, look we've, we've fucked this up. Like you got to take ownership for it and own it as a, as a team, I guess. But yeah, so what is that? Like they obviously touch on that in your the strides training that you're doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that is probably one of the main ones they they talk about for sure, and also the B2 have model. I don't know if you know about that. You know a lot of people go oh, you know, when I, when I have all the money, I'll be able to do this and then I will be happy. Yeah, you know but it's flipping that on his head and you know it's, it's being happy.
Speaker 2:Being happy.
Speaker 1:And the rest flows on. Yeah, and that's another big concept again. Not all over it yet. But, yeah, trying to work on it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, that took me a long time to get my head around that as well. I'd, I'd I'd talk about a little bit differently. Like you've got to be happy with the destination you're at. Like, if you, if you feel like you're going to be happy when you get to there, how do you know that Exactly?
Speaker 2:Like, so what happens if you get to there and you feel the same way you're doing now. Then you're going to be searching for something else again. Yeah, you're never going to be happy. I think that's. I think that's the same with everything Like the tools you have, the cars you drive, the house you live in, all that type of stuff Like you you've really got to. I think the best way to deal with that sort of stuff, which I do very regularly now, almost on a daily basis, is you really just got to sit back and tagging your surroundings Like I do a lot of journaling right Stuff my journal and think, fuck, like like I'm alive. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I am the luckiest man alive. Yeah. Like look at, look at what I have, and, yeah, it's incredible, once you start thinking like that again, like we touched on before, like things start to fall in place. Yeah, it's a hard way to live in that when you always you always thinking something else is better, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And separating it from goals as well. You know, like, because you want goals, there's somewhere to get to. But you know you don't want that to become a blurred line either.
Speaker 2:So what? I guess what some of your goals make. So you're now, you're, you're moving on and trying to get more building work rather than just all the carpentry work. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:So that the next sort of what the next phase of my business is yeah, trying to start doing our own stuff 100%. Well, I really would like to wind up the contract. Carpentry is probably another massive goal I'm over it completely yeah.
Speaker 2:So you're looking for a lucky, you're trying to get enough building work that you can sort of just cut it off. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so, like all of September is our own work, which is great, it's just hopeful we can start filling the books for the rest and just keep going.
Speaker 2:What's your opinion on like being so young, like, do you think being young and not having experience? People possibly don't look at to do their job because they're worried about how it's going to turn out. It's extremely hard.
Speaker 1:But one thing I've learned and I definitely think coaching has got something to do with is being able to really effectively communicate. You know what you're going to give them for the money. You know, and I've had it a few times where you know I've done a quote. They've left it for a few months and come back to it trying to get the same price. You want to know we've got to reprice this now You've you've expired, the quotes expired, let's really look at it and it comes in more. And you know I could easily just say well, that's just how it is. But you know, being able to effectively communicate. Well, you know, our pricing structures changed. We were actually not making any money with the old pricing. You know, and there's one thing I learned from Launchpad was about getting your overheads in there at the start before you add your margin. Yeah, you know, and that was one of the big changes that I've done once we came off Launchpad.
Speaker 2:We need to get you on your quotas. So look, another tip I'd be giving you. If you are changing your wording, like now, like quotes is something contractors do, like you're starting to build, now you want to be giving your clients proposals, like it's a it's a whole different ball game, like you're actually providing a proposal which outlines all the scapes of works and the allowances and everything you're going to deliver them. Yeah, and even just little things like that. Like it just you come across more professional.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you turn up to a client, or a client contacts you and you say, oh, look for us, you know, for us to be able to provide your proposal, I've got to do this, this, this, like how much more professional is that sound? And I look, I'll smash you out a quote.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, 100%. Even you know, like right now I use build exact and when we got that on board and started using that, like the difference between just right and something up in zero as a quote. Yeah. And then that the proposal that you know build exact quote is can put together is exponentially different.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so what are you? What's some things you're doing to get some more work in the door?
Speaker 1:So I've just got a marketing guy on board, so we're paying him every month and he's taken over all our social media. So I've had a lot of people message me and say, oh, what's going on differently, because you never used to do these posts and things that are going up. And so I'm not doing them, you know so that's been a big one, and I believe that's honestly why I've got the work for next month of my own stuff.
Speaker 2:Just be careful with that. Like you still want to make sure you're attracting people that are your people, like your culture, your quality, your beliefs, all those things that you don't want to get it too separated. Like your, your, your story still needs to come across in that marketing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, 100%, and that's probably something we need to work on, you know, because right now all I do is the behind the scene 3DOs, what's going on on site. You know things like that. I think probably bringing a bit more back to personal level would be good for sure, because it is very just, you know, dry, I suppose yeah it's a photo, finish photo and a ride up. There's no, there's no personal connection there.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I got a person that personal connection is the biggest thing and and making sure you got cool Like I'm sure they do if they're mighty, feel it like making sure you got calls to action and All that sort of thing. But like what is your goal to Like get to a point where you've got a supervisor that's maybe run a couple, run a couple of jobs and like you're more involved with all the pre-planning type stuff because I Notice.
Speaker 2:I went back quickly this morning and flicks through all the messages We've sent over the period of time on social media and I notice that each time there's been quite a few times where I've done stories about our pack process or avoiding variations and things that you've jumped in and said 100%.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I mean a hundred percent. I know where I want to be in the business, which is a purely business development off the tools I absolutely hate. I love being in the sun with the boys, the banter, but I much prefer talking to people and yeah and then doing the business development. I actually really enjoy that. So that's goal is, you know, next 12 months is sort of. How do we move from me having to be on-site every day with the boys to me being in the office?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, man, that's a really good goal to have. Yeah, and so you? How do you do your golden things? Are you writing them down?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I actually made this little thing About a month ago. I reckon I called it goal mountain. Yeah which is the same thing as what my coaching does. Really, it's the big goals at the top of the mountain. Yeah there's seven or eight base camps up the mountain. What's the little goals to get to the big girl? Yeah, has been one of the big changes for me, so now I can see all right, this is the journey that we have to go on.
Speaker 1:That's so important even better if I can get the boys to set out the journey. I've got the vision for the business. The boys make the path up the mountain. Don't be even better. Yeah, then they've bought in, they've bought into the idea.
Speaker 2:Yeah, 100% but it's so important because a lot of us just are focused on the ing destination and yet we got no Plan like like a pilot doesn't fly a plane without having a course. So you don't sail a ship around the world without plotting a course, or nowhere you go. You don't even go for a drive on the weekend without following. It's funny. Like so many, I know why it takes so long to click for a lot, for a lot of us.
Speaker 2:But having that outline and I think the other really important part of that is you've got to, you've got to celebrate those, you've got to celebrate those base camps, yeah yeah, the little wins, little wins. Because the little wins inspire the next win and the next win, and it's it's super important. Mate, you're um, I'm really keen to follow your progress and see where you end up. Look, if you're on this journey now, like, like I said before, like don't stop. Yeah. Are you addicted yet?
Speaker 1:Like I am. I am addicted to the progress and you know me and my coach. We talk about a lot. Just momentum is the key now, because I Lot of the things I talked about this initially with coaching was that I felt like I was just slipping. I'd get a grip and I'd slip, and then we'd just be like, don't burn out. Almost. Yeah so now that we've got some movement, so get, do you know?
Speaker 2:Can you think of an example Like what's that? What's? It's just?
Speaker 1:like things like we had the big crew, so I built up to this big crew and then it all went to shit, yeah, and then we've slipped and now we got to rebuild again you know. So it's sort of now that we're moving in the right direction. It's keeping the momentum now. Yeah, you know don't have to speed up the hill, but, you know, like an old steam engine.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, I just keep the power down. It always get there, just chugs along. I think that's another important lesson that you like just small steps. Yeah, like you are you've got to know the journey, you've got to take the small steps and you got to celebrate the the Winds along the way, and that just makes that end goal so much more Exciting.
Speaker 1:I guess, and that, my coach, we had to give me a woo up, you know, because it was exactly that. I thought it was like a race. Let's just get up there as quick as possible.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and everyone's gonna do it differently, like everyone, like we're all very different people. Like have you done anything on like who you are? Like who, finding out who you are, your strengths, your weaknesses? Not massively no what's your, what's your superpower?
Speaker 1:I'm still trying to work that one out.
Speaker 2:It's um, yeah, it all plays a part in it, but um, mate, you're talking before. Now we started recording. Like you're, you've moved out your long drive from your jobs and stuff. Like are you, is your plan to find work closer to home? So you're not wasting so much time traveling.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, so that's what the top of gold mountain is that I want to be gipsy lands best renovation builder. So that's gold mountain.
Speaker 2:Well, you've put it out mate, it's in the universe now. That's in the universe.
Speaker 1:Now, yeah, and so it's. Yeah, really trying to reel that work back in.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and what? So? What do you what? What are you doing on these own drives, like you podcast?
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know, level up, it's a, it's a mixture, so in the morning it's a podcast, you know whatever it may be, and then the afternoon it's got to be a jam out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, cranking the chains, that's it. Yeah, what's your favorite? Akadaka?
Speaker 1:song. Uh, house bells pretty good, yeah, yeah. How would it have been to a few concerts? I've been to both their last concerts. Yeah, so black ice and rock and roll train I was unreal, you know. But uh, word on the street Was that they'll come back.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but they better do it soon because they got some age on them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they're not getting any younger.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, mate, they're incredible concerts. Yeah, I think I've been to five of their concerts now. They're, they're insane, they're loud, they're buddy. I didn't actually like the last one too much. I thought it was too loud and they were compensating for their voices getting bad, like you couldn't make out the words that's um. I think that's just part of being an old rock band.
Speaker 1:That's it.
Speaker 2:So what else do you do, mate, to chill out Like you're? A young bloat. You got a. You got a family.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's got the misses we got first one on the way. So um love camping, Love it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so that is, that is your business, and the coaching and everything and the drive you have now and like does that inspire you? Like to be able to do more of that, if like you run a better business yet more time. You got more cash. You, you can do more of what you like doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you know, funny enough, in the coaching we had a mentor come in which was one of their old clients who's now coach and he built a part of his. One of his goals was he wanted to build a business that he could be on the road Full-time and have the business work remotely. So you know, anything's possible. You just got to build it to that point, don't you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you want to get out camping and traveling? Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I tried to throw the idea to the missus Uh, before we bought this house to, uh, you know, buy van or go on the road for years to travel and chipy sort of set up. Yeah, just wanted to fit too much of a keen on that.
Speaker 2:There's a lot of people doing that now. Yeah, yeah, it's huge. Yeah, um, did you follow that, uh, rampson?
Speaker 1:uh, rampson? Yeah, he's killing it, isn't he?
Speaker 2:Yeah he's, he's going well. He's a local boy from brismund. I've never met him in person, but I love what he's doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love his truck.
Speaker 2:It's a beast in there, uh, but yeah, there's a lot of people doing that now, like just packing up, and I know a lot of people that are making a pretty Healthy income by um traveling like handyman. Yeah, painters, roofers.
Speaker 1:Carpenters.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it could. It can be a good lifestyle.
Speaker 1:I mean, in those remote towns there's not a chippy for whatever trade for ages if you're a bit of a jack of all.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know you do pretty well, I reckon yeah Well, mate, look, really appreciate your time and uh for coming up here today and especially why you're up here to get this Award. So what's the plans? What's uh, you're gonna spend a couple of days here in brissey, or what?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so fly out sunday, Spend two days. You might go down to dream world tomorrow and yeah see how we go.
Speaker 2:Oh, good on you, mate, we'll enjoy your time here and uh. So you look for anyone listening in that. Where can they find you like, what's your uh, what's your social medias and stuff?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so um website signaturebuildingcocomau, or find us on instagram at signature underscore building co.
Speaker 2:Yeah no, look, guys go and check him out. Um yeah, look, I said I'll take my hat off to you, mate. You're putting in the hard Yard. So anyone down in what gypsum area needs, uh, some renovating extensions. Give him, give you a shout out. Hey, that's it.
Speaker 1:Thanks very much for having me. No worries, cheers, mate. Are you ready to build smarter, live better and enjoy life? Then head over to live like buildcom forward, slash, elevate to get started.
Speaker 2:Everything discussed during the level up podcast with me, dwayne pierce, is based solely on my own personal experiences and those experiences of my guests. The information, opinions and recommendations presented in this podcast are for general information only, and any reliance on the information provided in this podcast is done at your own risk. We recommend that you attain your own professional advice in respect to the topics discussed during this podcast.