Level Up with Duayne Pearce
I'll Never Drive A Lamborghini When Everyone Around Me is Riding Scooters.
When life tackled him hard, former NRL pro turned builder Matt of Frameology didn't just get back up—he built a whole new life. From the grit of the footy field to the grind of the building site, Matt's journey is a masterclass in resilience and transformation, inspiring anyone who's contemplating a second act in life. In a candid exchange, Matt lays bare the playbook of his success, revealing how the skills he honed on the sports field have served him in the construction industry, and how winning the Brisbane Master Builders Rising Star Award is just the beginning of his story.
Have you ever considered the business behind the buildings you see? It's not just bricks and mortar; it's about forming the right teams, networking, and navigating the nuanced challenges of the construction world. His insights are crucial for anyone looking to scale the heights of entrepreneurial success without losing their footing.
Strap in for a holistic take on healing, as Matt uncovers the benefits of alternative therapies, breath work, and the powerful impact of mental health practices on professional prowess. If you're seeking balance in the relentless push-and-pull of business and personal life, Matt's story of embracing trust, delegation, and a deeper appreciation for the journey will resonate deeply. Join us as we explore the constructs of not just buildings, but a life built with intention, harmony, and fulfilment.
We're on a mission to elevate the professionalism of the residential construction industry, and help everyone enjoy building and renovating homes.
Easy to use Quoting software for Builders. Produce professional and accurate proposals. Quickly and accurately measure and markup plans in minutes. Win more jobs and track costs. 21 Day Free Trial.
Living PurposedWe want to gather with a purposeful intention to explore the world around us. ...
Listen on: Apple Podcasts Spotify
check out more podcasts here...
https://levelupwithduaynepearce.buzzsprout.com
When life tackled him hard, former NRL pro turned builder Matt of Frameology didn't just get back up—he built a whole new life. From the grit of the footy field to the grind of the building site, Matt's journey is a masterclass in resilience and transformation, inspiring anyone who's contemplating a second act in life. In a candid exchange, Matt lays bare the playbook of his success, revealing how the skills he honed on the sports field have served him in the construction industry, and how winning the Brisbane Master Builders Rising Star Award is just the beginning of his story.
Have you ever considered the business behind the buildings you see? It's not just bricks and mortar; it's about forming the right teams, networking, and navigating the nuanced challenges of the construction world. His insights are crucial for anyone looking to scale the heights of entrepreneurial success without losing their footing.
Strap in for a holistic take on healing, as Matt uncovers the benefits of alternative therapies, breath work, and the powerful impact of mental health practices on professional prowess. If you're seeking balance in the relentless push-and-pull of business and personal life, Matt's story of embracing trust, delegation, and a deeper appreciation for the journey will resonate deeply. Join us as we explore the constructs of not just buildings, but a life built with intention, harmony, and fulfilment.
We're on a mission to elevate the professionalism of the residential construction industry, and help everyone enjoy building and renovating homes.
Easy to use Quoting software for Builders. Produce professional and accurate proposals. Quickly and accurately measure and markup plans in minutes. Win more jobs and track costs. 21 Day Free Trial.
Living PurposedWe want to gather with a purposeful intention to explore the world around us. ...
Listen on: Apple Podcasts Spotify
check out more podcasts here...
https://levelupwithduaynepearce.buzzsprout.com
you know, anytime something sort of happened, I was super negative, like I was one of those guys that you know we would lose on a Sunday over and I wouldn't get over it until I ran on the field next week. It would. I'd carry it all week and I just have a shit week or week and just realized that I was the problem.
Speaker 2:That's huge man. Yeah, g'day guys, welcome back to another episode of Level Up. We are back in the shed this afternoon. It's actually a bloody hot day here in Brisbane, but it's another cracking episode coming out with a cracking guess. So I've made this guy for a little while. He's part of my Builders Breakfast Group and I'll tell you what it is. Kicking some goals. He started off as a cabinet maker at the same time as getting in the early stages of a professional NRL career. He's played for some of the NRL's biggest teams, including the local one, but and most recently has taken out the Brisbane Master Builders Rising Star Awards. So a massive warm welcome to Matt from Frameology. How are you Good mate? How are you Excellent mate? Thanks so much for coming over and having a chat and I've been looking forward to this for a while, like you're. I think you're a quite achiever.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, you could say that Just head down and work an art.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So make use a little bit before we get into stuck into the building side of things like You've done a lot in your lot. You're only only quite young, 34, yeah and yeah. So you, born in Mount Isa, moved to Bundaberg. Yep, grew up around that area and jumped on a plane, moved to Sydney and started a professional NRL career.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. So I actually started a school based apprenticeship as a cabinet maker. It was my mother's sort of idea to have some of the backing because we knew sort of I wanted to chase an NRL career. So we started that while I was at school. Yeah, my school was actually really good. They did like a one day to I think it was one and a half day of work experience mixed in with your school. So, yeah, one and a half to two days a week I'd work.
Speaker 1:This is in up in Bundaberg, up in Bundaberg, yeah, yeah, so you're a rumboy, yes and no, I know what to stay away from. It depends whether you're in for a fight or not. Yeah, but yeah, I sort of started off that cabinetry apprenticeship and then, before I knew it, I sort of was scattered at a local rugby league competition and was on a plane to Sydney at 16 and a half and yeah, so how does that work?
Speaker 2:So you like, did you go on your own, did have family with you Like.
Speaker 1:So my uncle actually lives in Sydney and my brother was there at the time. He had actually had a contract at the same team. Funny enough as well. So yeah. I moved there and moved in with my brother who was living with my uncle before, but yeah, we moved in together. I was on the big wicket of $325 with a $220 rent a week Just hanging out for those footy payments and yeah, sort of the dream was kicking off. I was sort of chasing that NRL contract or full time contract.
Speaker 2:And at the same time, you're still continuing to. You ended up doing it, your tannertary apprenticeship down there as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I the first sort of three months I got there it was just train. I sort of just tried to get myself in the swing of a NRL club. I was there at Manly Seagulls. So on the side of that I went and chased up my own work because I knew at some point I was going to need to earn some money and the savings were dwindling. So yeah, I just found a local cabinetry company and sort of I would work 6.30 in the morning to 4.30 in the hour and then straight to training and train till 8.30, 9 o'clock at night and do it every day.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so how long did you do that for?
Speaker 1:I did that the whole time I was in Sydney, yeah, so yeah, good, four or five years before I sort of landed a contract, actually scored a contract up here while I was playing in Brisbane against the Broncos in the 20s competition and yeah, straight here for reserve grade For the Broncos. Yeah, it was reserve grade, so they were a feeder team for the Broncos, so it was Winner Manly Seagulls and I was coached under the late Paul Green. So yeah, it was big change again.
Speaker 2:You know, moving from I'd never lived in Brisbane before, yeah, man, that's a pretty exciting start for a young fella to be following your dreams and then obviously, have the initiative to keep doing an apprenticeship on the side. Yeah, and then. So where did the transition come from the footy and the cabinetmaking to being a builder?
Speaker 1:So when I come to Brisbane I actually moved from cabinetmaking to carpentry so I sort of short switch. It didn't really take long to extend that into carpentry and it was just more of a I guess, long term plan to become a builder. So my stepfather in Bunderburg is actually a builder as well. It's like, oh is in the back of my head, I could go back there and sort of jump in there and maybe eventually run things as well. But yeah, sort of still chasing the dream. Had a few sort of major injuries along the way, like I've probably had about 11 surgeries to date Knees, shoulders, yeah, face everything.
Speaker 2:So it's a hard profession, in that any type of professional sport like it is full on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, look, I would still say building pushes the limits a lot more than not physically but mentally or sort of all around it. It pushed it more than sport. But the fact that I was playing a professional game on a Sunday afternoon at four o'clock and I had to work Monday morning was, you know, no recoveries. Yeah, you're really struggling for a fair bit there, but yeah, it definitely created a lot of determination. I would say. Well and commitment yeah, commitment resilience, yeah.
Speaker 2:And so you finished your carpentry apprenticeship.
Speaker 1:Yeah, then I was actually recruited by Melbourne Storm and their feeder club was at Sunshine Coast. So myself and my fiance moved to the Sunshine Coast and then from there I went to Melbourne and actually, yeah, I was training with the storm and played a couple of NRL trial games that year and I was sort of two weeks away from origin period and we sort of were hearing I was about to have my debut, at a fairly late age considering it was, I think, I was about 26. And yeah, two weeks before I was having some niggling groin issues and, yeah, I couldn't run. I literally walked out onto the training paddock, went to run and my legs wouldn't move, they just wouldn't tick over and I knew I sort of was in a bit of trouble there.
Speaker 2:And was that the end of your football career?
Speaker 1:So I got the surgery made. It come back with the feeder team Sunshine Coast, the Falcons, and I actually tore both the Ductors in my return game, which is still not attached.
Speaker 2:Jeez, mate Footy just was trying to tell you something. It was just cruel.
Speaker 1:Yeah, some people get through their career with not a single issue and others just have to go the hard way. Yeah, I guess it probably instilled a few things that I could take on further. You know, whereas people without those issues, you know they get something hard post career and they have a cry about it, and you know, the world's over.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, you definitely gave it your best shot, by the sounds of it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I gave it a good, good hot crack, I reckon.
Speaker 2:So like you already had something to fall back on, which is a good thing, because a lot of professional sports people don't do that. They just commit everything to the sport and when something goes wrong, they've got to go back and start again.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. So reserve grade in Queensland is actually a lot better pay Like you could through the season you could actually earn a wage Like I was, sort of over a thousand bucks a week. You know, you could actually survive in that period without working, which a lot of people surprisingly did. They just put it all into and you know there's a fair few, there's a couple that made it and there's a fair few that didn't you know. Yeah, yeah, so at some point, reality had to hit.
Speaker 2:And then so you ended up back down in Brisbane. So how long's frameology?
Speaker 1:been going for Frameology's been going since 2017. So I just started out. I got my builder's license so I actually was contracting, and then I went to get supervision experience so I could get my builder's license. Got that, then got my builder's license, but I still just kept doing. I went out back out on my own and did carpentry contracting. So I did saw your normal development homes frames, fix outs, all that sort of thing, the fix outs. I was really good at my cabinetry background. So, yeah, I did that for money I guess quick turnover and I did a bit of work for a builder in Brisbane for doing renovations and things like that. So yeah, that sort of kicked me off into the renovations, which is where I wanted to go. Anyway, it was always a long-term plan, so everything was, I guess, planned to a degree.
Speaker 2:But that like having a crack at those different things like I think all younger people, when they're trying to get to become a builder like, really need to have a go at lots of different types of building because even though you might end up doing one particular type, you can never have enough skills For sure. And that volume type work. Although I'm not a big fan of it, I did a lot of it and it taught me how to be very efficient, because if you don't get shit done quick, you just don't make money. So it definitely helps you pick up your speed and your skills. But it's unusual for people to have a bit of a path and have a think about they want to do a bit of this to get that experience. They want to do a bit of that to get that experience. A lot of people just want to go straight to the top and then struggle for years or rely on other people because they don't necessarily have all the skills that they need.
Speaker 1:You see that a lot these days actually with, I guess, the younger builders or carpentry business owners. Some of them are pulling more money than I am a week and then they wonder why they have to put money back in and what's going on with the business and why they're in the red here and there. A lot of them are trying to get the big F-150 or 250 or whatever and then they haven't actually earned the stripes and get the experience.
Speaker 2:Everyone wants to go straight to the top.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they don't realise the paths that some of us went through. They went through a lot of obstacles and I definitely did. I moved into architectural building as COVID hit.
Speaker 2:That would make it scary.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was very scary. It was one of those things where I was slowly working off the tools to start working on my business and, at the end of the day, you just had to put the belt back on.
Speaker 2:We sort of strained a little bit and just worked really hard.
Speaker 1:That's probably the only reason we got through it. There's a lot of people I knew that didn't and just got out of it because they were just sick of it.
Speaker 2:You just got to do what you got to do. You just say if you've got to try the nail back on, you try the nail back on. I'm very similar to that. Whatever situation comes up, there's no hierarchy. You have to do whatever it takes just to keep things flowing and through COVID we did very similar things.
Speaker 2:But if you don't, that's when you're going to get into trouble, get left behind or all those types of things it does frustrates me when I see all these younger guys driving around in the new drill calves and the new trailers. It's great. Everyone deserves to earn good money. But you see some of the work that gets put out there and it's definitely not up to my standard. I was always bored up. You said you've got to earn your stripes. You get to this level and you do so long at that and then you get to that level and then you get to that level. I know myself we put some incredible young guys through their time and I know they've got incredible potential to be great carmen or possibly great builders. But as soon as they finish their apprenticeship they're just like I'm out of here, I'm going to get the big bucks. I don't need to learn off you for another year or two. I'm going to get paid more money and you're a big advocate for it as well.
Speaker 1:with knowing your numbers. These guys are buying these trucks and trailers and things with money that's not theirs. It's just in the account. That's what you find a lot. They're quick to spend it as soon as it comes in. It's you. You're the last your money's going to go back if you owe people money.
Speaker 2:I know about you, but I've definitely been there. I used to spend more money than what I was making. I guess the thing is what you learn from it. You've got to learn from your mistakes. I also see a lot of young guys out there that are Just getting themselves into debt and then getting anxiety and getting depressed and like they understand up in this rollercoaster that Can be hard to break. If you, if you're not hanging around the right people, you're not for sure I don't know getting some sort of mentoring or Like there's a lot of keeping up with the Jones's, I think, in our industry.
Speaker 1:Yeah, 100%, yeah, it's all, it's all looks, social status, it's. You know, I've got a Land Cruiser, I'm doing well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:It's not always the case.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So, man, you've managed to go really well. It was, I think, like one reason I've been really excited to Catch up with you today. Like it's been a hectic year this year. Like I said at the beginning, you're You're one of the members of the bill's breakfast group that we have, and not this year's been everyone's been hectic, so there's Been very hard to catch up with people and the whole crew to yeah, the whole crew. But I Was really like I loved it, like you jumped in very early. I you'd you don't need to start at your business and I think when you first reached out, like you just wanted to come because you wanted to be around other builders and gain knowledge and things, and I think that's just such an important thing for anyone that's starting out in a business to hang around People that have been in the trenches and and done the hard yards. Because if we can all help each other out, yeah, and you can avoid some of the mistakes that other people have made, like it just benefits everybody.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and like even out the first, what one to two meetings I went to I didn't say boo pee, but I was there to take it in, to take, you know, lessons from everyone. Yeah, you guys have been in the industry. A lot of you have had your business as long, nearly as long as I've been alive not me.
Speaker 1:Like Seb to scana and stuff. You know, third-generation, like the experience and knowledge that they've had passed down, is not really something I had, like I could have gone back to Bunderberg and, you know, taken over that company and my stepdad's been a builder for 30 years and but I wanted to create my own path. So and I do totally different stuff to what he does. He does a lot of sort of budget, transportable homes and things like that steel frame. So I sort of we're vastly different. So I needed to find a group of, I guess, role models or People that have walked the path before me to get this knowledge from. I do sort of find it.
Speaker 2:Do you think that's um Well, do you think that's really helped you excel quicker than if you weren't talking to other Builders and asking questions here and there, like I, because I know a lot of people in our industry? It's like they're afraid to give away their trade secrets and they they're Like younger guys can try and ask for advice, but they won't always get.
Speaker 2:The right advice or someone will take the piss out of them or something like that. I just think it's so important for our industry to talk and communicate and share industry Knowledge and experience and all those types of things.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's a lot of stats, even coming out of America that you know. I can't remember the guy that does a podcast but literally saying, for every 40 people that retire, only seven come in. Yeah, where's that knowledge gonna pass over if the young guys are getting like, if you take in the piss and they're just gonna, I don't want to ask, cuz yeah, I'll just sit here and listen and try and make it up myself and yeah but yeah it's.
Speaker 1:It's a tough one, but I think it's making a safe space for them, I guess, to ask questions.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So what's some of the challenges you faced in your not getting your business stuff and running and?
Speaker 1:Our biggest challenge up until recently was the team, so staffing to allow me to work on the business and actually pull back some time so I'm not doing 80 hour weeks and Candice my partner's getting the shits with me and all that sort of thing like Team was the biggest thing cuz.
Speaker 2:You're like I don't think I don't know if we mentioned yet but you're also a bit of a catwalk model, right, come on. Hey look, you don't tell me you got no time. You're fitting in a lot of stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, look, I fit that in. But you know, then there's the weekend that you've. You got to work to cover that. But yeah, yeah, I'd double in a few different bits and pieces.
Speaker 2:You're definitely having a crack, that's for sure.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, well, that's what it's all about. We're in there for a short time, so, yeah, um, yeah, I, I guess. Like I said earlier, I think building is Probably one of the most extreme professions that is around, like with the stress, finances, the amount of hours you're trying to work your staff, like all these sort of things.
Speaker 2:It's a lot of money passing together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, um, like, if this is a lot harder for me than being a sports person was and you know I was one that was getting some major injuries and really having to fight back to get back every time this is still harder. Yeah, it's, and that is the reality and, like you know, I put a dampener on it for young guys. But if they don't know what they're coming into, you know it can like professional sport and Building, like construction. They have two really high suicide rates and I think that is because of the knowledge when they come in, they don't know how hard it's gonna be.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and a lot of people that come into the industry come into it because they think that it's not as hard as what it really is. Yeah, and then it hits them and they have to take a few steps back.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I was the same and I knew from my step dad, and from sort of talking to people. I knew how hard it was. And it still was harder than I thought. Um, particularly through, you know, with COVID. No one had dealt with that before, so it was a whole nother element. But yeah, it was really really hard and you know, I had plenty of meltdowns, plenty of breakdowns. Even last year I, you know, we sort of had a job that finished up and I starting to question the reward verse or you know gratitude from the client even for what we'd done, and and I was like, yeah, really weighing up whether a reward was worth what we were doing and how hard we were working. So I think it's a, it's a battle all the time. It's not, doesn't you? Don't just get to a point where you're like, oh, this is just so easy now?
Speaker 2:You do, you do, you can, yeah, 100% like that's, and that's why this, why I'm doing this podcast. Yeah, you do have to put in the hard yards and do the work, but it's it definitely gets to that point and and make with your commitment and your ambition, like you're, you're definitely gonna get to that point. Yeah, so there's so many moving parts to our what a builder is or even what a tradie is, and I Feel like people have this very set perception of what tradies and builders are. Yeah, and Like something. I'm definitely Again, part of this podcast and everything I'm doing is to lift the reputation of builders and Really help people understand what what a builder really is and what a builder really does. Yeah, because I think when we can do that, it'll help the whole industry, but it'll also help builders Earn what they deserve to earn for sure.
Speaker 2:And let's see before I'd bang on about all the time like it's all about the data, it's all about the numbers, and I've spent a long time on that roller coaster ride. Exactly what you just said, like questioning it, like You'd have One, two, three jobs, that it'd be like yes, like this is fantastic, killing it, and then you'd have one, two, three, maybe four or five. Yeah, that would just suck up everything you've just made and all of a sudden you're down the dump again and, yeah, I think the world's against you and the industry, shit and all this type of stuff. But Our industry is so difficult because Nobody understands it and there's so many layers to it. And, like one of the things we really do, like it took me years and years to get my head around it and we do it all the time now with the guys that come in to live, like, build, like the first thing we focus on is getting them to understand their overheads and what it's taking to run their business.
Speaker 2:Yeah and At like. We have had hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of builders go through that now and I can honestly count on one hand how many builders Even close, yeah, to covering their overheads, like most of them Putting on their jobs in total for overheads and profit Less, all the same as what it's actually taking them to run their business. Yeah, and like.
Speaker 2:It's like a light bulb and like it's like a light bulb as soon as they they get it and understand it. It's like holy shit, like that is why there's nothing in my bank accounts, why I got no cash flights, while I'm stressed all the time. It's why I feel shit about the industry. But the reason, a big reason for that is we're competing like Any, like builders are in this. Unless you sort of put yourself out there and you, you build a very good reputation and Around your quality and what you're delivering all those types of things you end up in this big bucket of builders that is just competing on price and, like I got coordinate for ages and you, you literally sit at a meeting and lower your price In your head still thinking that you're making money, but you've actually just yeah, you've just literally lowered your price and you are going to do that job for nothing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you've already spent a hundred hours or so getting that price, so why are you now undermining all that time that you've just worked on it and going, oh, in five minutes I'm just gonna, yeah, yeah, I'll drop that. Yeah it's, can we, can we sign, can we we? Good yeah, desperation, I guess sometimes it's, it's hard.
Speaker 2:Look at all ties together like you've got to keep your team working, you've got to keep the cash flow coming in. Another thing that I think it's really underestimated in our industry is how much, like now that we track it all and we do our pack process and stuff like I spend, I Believe I spend three more, or we know from our data like I spend three times more time On a project during the like from inquiry to signing a building contract. Yeah, then I do once the job starts.
Speaker 2:Yeah right like, once the job starts, like we got incredible servers and incredible team on site. Like I still go to site visit, check on teams, help out with ordering and those types of things. But it's really underestimated how much time a builder has to spend yeah prior to even getting a job.
Speaker 1:Well, that's what we sell like, because we don't do anything for free, we don't tender. Um, that's our sales pitch. Is that's where the actual work is? Yeah, Um this is the physical work, but the work to actually get you there is in the first part.
Speaker 2:I'm so pleased to hear that you're doing a yeah Well, yeah, we call it the pack process, but you're doing some sort of pre construction process like that's just. To me, that's an absolute game changer, look, and it does so many things that it sets you up as a professional that builds trust with your clients.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and like, the number one thing is you, you get to build a relationship with the client before you've gone and Sign the contract and then you feel valued yourself and you know it doesn't just go, I'll get to it tomorrow or whatever. You're like Actually being paid to do this right now. I'm going to do this right now. I'm not going to do it later or while I'm half asleep and tired and yeah, um, that's the biggest thing I found was when you start feeling valued and they've paid for your service you, you, it's, it's comes to the forefront. It's like all right, no, this is this is what I gotta do. This is they're putting trust in me to get this to a process so we can start, yeah, and not just throw a number at them and go you want to do it or not. A lot of people do like I'm still here in stories, like we're Doing a like a pre-con process right now. I actually Signed up to your pack process when you first brought it out.
Speaker 1:Yeah so we went through that as well, just to see and compare, and yeah, yeah, I pulled a few things from that as well, like I generally pull a bit from everywhere and yeah.
Speaker 2:It's the best way, mate. But and look, I don't know how you do yours, but like I definitely find, um, because our pack process Is an actual like you can actually say to the client, like we've got to go from here to here, yeah, before we can sign a contract. Like when you can actually demonstrate to a client how much work is actually involved. Most clients are like, you know, like no worries, we'll pay for that. Like that's a lot of work.
Speaker 1:Yeah you're getting architects on board now as well to actually get you so early in the piece as well. We're still fighting that battle a little bit when, like, the professionals have already come through and done all their you know, engineering and all sorts of things and we weren't involved in that. So we're kind of taking it a bit later in the piece, but which which?
Speaker 2:is Hard, because then you're still trying to claw things back, or because, like, honestly, how often do you get A set of drawings or something presented to you and then they tell you the budget and you're like, oh yes, wait, we can do that, yeah.
Speaker 1:Never, never, yeah, yeah. We've had a couple this year alone where I've just they're going off. Another builder told me it's going to be about this much. They did a bit of a prelim for me. It was a one pager and I was just like no, no way. Like you, either up your budget or we pull some stuff out. And some of them have redesigned, and there was one that, um, I said no, you won't, you won't get it. This was probably 18 months ago. And, um, no, no, we will architect down. Client we're both and I know we're. We're pretty sure it's good, it's good, said, all right, we'll Give it here, price it all up, and it was seven hundred thousand dollars every budget over budget.
Speaker 2:That's a big one.
Speaker 1:I told you it's. You know, you've just wasted your money, yeah, um. And then they've had to go through this full redesign process over 18 months and they're nearly ready now for it to be looked at again.
Speaker 2:It just makes it so hard, doesn't it? For everybody?
Speaker 2:Yeah like everybody's wasting their time Yep, and time is money. Definitely, like the earlier that a builder can get involved, um, like, I believe trades like there's a lot of trades out there that should be doing it as well Um, especially ones like cabinet makers, sparkies and things that do up electrical drawings or have to do shop drawings like Um, because you quite often see a lot of suppliers That'll charge a fee to develop their shop drawings, or, yeah, um, especially once you get into the more hiring work with a lot of the detail and stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely yeah, and there's a lot of back and forth, so it's a lot of time there again before they can even order all their stuff and yeah get cracking on it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like for me, someone that charges a fee and, look, this is definitely a big mindset change, like I never used to be like this. But for me, uh, a supplier or a contractor that values himself enough to charge and it might only be a hundred bucks, but that values themselves enough to go. Hang on a minute. My time's valuable. If you want me to come and meet you on site or do a site inspection or provide you some sort of pricing, it's going to cost you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm all for that too, if they're like we do have a part of our processes. We bring our trades out and they have a look around and make sure that we usually try and get them to price it up. And then we go out and we're like, all right, we'll now make sure and adjust and then we're good to go. We send everything out through Build a Trend with photos, like I usually have already been there once or twice. But same thing. If they said, oh, it's a hundred bucks, I wouldn't have a problem with it. I'd be like, if I know you're going to put this to the front and nail it a hundred bucks, no worries, it's. If they start going, oh, it's going to be two grand, hang on a minute.
Speaker 2:But it's just getting an aspect. It's getting a little bit of commitment from everybody, isn't it? And the other thing, like well, there's so many benefits to charging a fee, but for me it's commitment, like if you're sparky, he's going to charge you a couple hundred bucks to help you out with the like. Go meet with the clients and figure electrical and put a drawing together. Like that's awesome value. Yes, that couple hundred bucks isn't probably covering the time they're going to spend on it, but at least everybody knows that that client's getting educated on what they want to go into cost and there's a lot better chance that that job's actually going to move forward. So you're actually going to get the work in the long run, which is where you're going to make up your money, definitely.
Speaker 1:And I find out even our fee. It doesn't cover all the time that it takes, but it's about skin in the game, it's about all right, we're a team here, you're going to put some in, I'm going to give you more time than you're actually paying for and we're going to proceed together and we're going to get this happening. Yeah, Because our job really is to get that plan set to start.
Speaker 2:Yeah, essentially our job. So have you? Have you got any coaching, mentoring to get to where you are?
Speaker 1:No, I did join very early in the piece, the Association of Professional Builders. I did that. This was like back in 2017 when I started, and I stayed with that and sort of chipped away at it, while working on the tools and trying to do everything myself, like we've all done, and I sort of got a lot of processes in place and then, just talking to, yeah, a couple of other builders that I know as well, we sort of swapped a few things here and there, but no proper mentoring, no sort of one-on-one mentoring, anything. I've literally pulled pieces from everywhere and asked questions and just tried to get as much together as I can and made my own sort of way through. But that's super important.
Speaker 2:There's a lot of people out there that don't even do that. I'm a massive fan of like asking questions, like no questions, just silly question Like, and yeah, it's again. It's something I haven't always like. At school I was the one that was afraid to put my hand up because I didn't want to look stupid. Where I've learnt the hard way like put your hand up, ask a question, even if it's a stupid question, like you're never going to know unless you ask a question.
Speaker 1:Yeah well, I was the same as well. I was a little shy kid. I'd never asked anyone any questions, just put my head down and got it done, and yeah. So I sort of brought that into adulthood. Even, you know, through my sporting career I never asked a question, I just went no, I'll figure it out, I'm not going to ask anything, I don't want to look stupid and, you know, have all the boys give me shit for the rest of the session or whatever, and yeah. So yeah, it's only been sort of a more recent thing where I've gone, like when I started my own business, even probably two years after, is when I really started going. I've got to ask and find out all this information because unless I can drum up the money to get someone one on one, I've got to get it myself.
Speaker 2:Yeah, knowledge is power, eh.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and then that's the whole walk before you can run thing. You know, like I have to pull those bits and create my own thing before I get the money to then pay someone to make it better, or yeah, sort of proceed with that.
Speaker 2:So you mentioned before that until recently your team had been a bit of a struggle, like what's been the change in the team. To everyone that's clicking there.
Speaker 1:So our biggest thing is human before skill set. So it's really dependent on what you are, how you are as a person. We're skills we can train. We're not too worried about that. Obviously, if we're hiring you in a highly skilled job like a lead carpenter or something, you do need to have the skills. But yeah, I think we just change our own mindset to all right, let's find humans we like and, because we hang out with them for so many hours of the day, let's find those humans that fit with what we believe in and then we'll move from there and we're just slowly just like all right, we'll pluck one here and pluck one there.
Speaker 1:And you know we did start with a young apprentice who got apprentice of the year as well. He came. He has been with us from pretty well day one.
Speaker 2:He loves you. He came on, he was on here a few weeks ago, as you know, and he yeah, mate, I take my half to you because you've obviously done very well with him. He respects you so much.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he's a good kid and he finishes his trade next week, so we have two finishings.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, I think just finding people that believe in similar things and you know that are they just fit sort of out, it's just a culture thing. It's, yeah, which we've had to sort of get rid of a few people that didn't really fit there, and it's been difficult because we've held on to people that probably did fit but they were good at their job. So we went oh, we need them, because you know staff are hard to come by and we just need to get these jobs done. But the minute we changed our mindset and went all right, as a human, it doesn't work. It's making these people feel like this and you know you make that change and all of a sudden, bang, everyone steps up and then you all of a sudden find these people who are a better fit that just come out of the woodwork, which is kind of what happened to us over a 12 month period, pulled together this team of from a few different places and, yeah, all of a sudden we have a like cohesive working team.
Speaker 2:That's awesome. Team is one of the hardest things of running a business.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2:And, like you said, it's like, oh, yeah, again, I bang on about all the time, like I just think again it's something that's very misunderstood. Like you can have a company that's got 300 staff but they're all sitting in an office in their own little cubicles might have a little chat at lunchtime yeah, that's in common. Trades are leaning over each other, smelling each other, sweating on each other, like, yeah, help, like physically helping each other. Like you have to be able to be someone that can sort of get on with people.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Yeah definitely, and I think, yeah, we sort of have really nailed that now, where we have two teams that can connect as well, like we sort of keep our leads on their jobs and then the other apprentices and other traits swap a little bit and sort of move it around and not a single drama with any of it.
Speaker 2:So we're very lucky.
Speaker 1:We're lucky it's not luck mate, you've created it. Yeah, yeah, but they just happened to be available when we needed them. We manifested that, we sort of brought that to fruition.
Speaker 2:You're big on that, aren't you? Yeah, yeah, tell us a little bit about that, because I'm huge on this too. I believe it's you get back exactly what you put out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so my fiance is actually probably the next level up from me again.
Speaker 1:She's very, very into it and she sort of talked me into a little bit.
Speaker 1:I was very stubborn and you know I was, I was willing to try, but I was like in my own time I'm not ready yet.
Speaker 1:And you know, I sort of fluffed around for a long time and then, yeah, I sort of got into it and you know, we started reading all the Joe Spenser books and, yeah, just getting into manifestation and I sort of like I've had therapy and all sorts of stuff too, just because you know other traumas and things that happen in life, and just realizing that, you know that negative mindset that you're in and you know, sort of you bring that energy with you everywhere.
Speaker 1:You're starting to bring more of that and I think the biggest change for me was to start to, you know, see what I want and see what the future looks like and that I don't want it to be negative and I don't want sort of bad energy around me which is, yeah, I'm sort of stepping up and up and up and getting further, deeper into it and we sort of we do our meditations now and everything as well, and yeah, we sort of just I think we're only really just, you know, just sort of breaking into it. There's a lot more we can go with with that, all that sort of things, but definitely.
Speaker 2:Like mindset positivity. Yeah, all that stuff is massive, isn't it?
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, I even found like through my sporting career, like every time I'd get an injury they were large injuries like it was fair to be negative about it, but it would go for months because I was out. Like at one point I was out for nine months. I just was negative for nine months till I could get back in and then I was good to go.
Speaker 2:But you do believe it took longer to recover because 100% you were putting all these negative vibes 100%.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that could be said for my whole career. You know, anytime something sort of happened, I was super negative, like I was one of those guys that you know we would lose on a Sunday over and I wouldn't get over it until I ran on the field next week Like I'd carry it all week and I just have a shit week or week, and yeah. So it slowly sort of just realized that I was the problem, that's huge man yeah that is a massive acknowledgement.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the day I realized I was the problem. I was retiring as well. So that's worked into this side. And you know like, yeah, just bringing that positivity and trying to. You know, when I go to site with the boys I'm bringing a positive energy, I'm not bringing negative vibes of like, oh this is hard, like Monday, or you know so. Then they all start going oh yeah, right, yeah, it's Monday, it is shit, you know so it's huge, isn't it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm so on the same page. I think it's fantastic, like and it excites me that it's like it's really changing, because even like I got family members like I was brought up that if you talked around this shit, you're a hippie or you're a wee-wee or my family saw that mate Like yeah, I still got a lot of family members that are like it.
Speaker 2:But yeah, it's, and look, I don't know at what point I started sort of disagreeing Like it's um man, again. There's a whole lot of can of worms here. But you almost get to a point where you've got to be prepared to lose some mates and friends. And yeah, pick and choose when and how much time you're spending with family and all that sort of shit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because, yeah, they say you've changed. Yeah, you've changed, you're a different person.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, they don't think it's for the better. Yeah, they think you've turned to this person that's different and Better than like just I don't know, I've heard it all it's the same.
Speaker 1:Like you know you, at some point you go I need to work out, I need to eat better, and you sort of go into like a bit of a gym phase or a workout phase and people go you've changed, you're addicted, but your life has actually improved. You know, you're not addicted, you've just made a lifestyle choice.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I find it's the same thing with yeah, like I've. There's plenty of people that I don't really talk to at all anymore. That used to be like really great mates, it's just you know you're in a different direction.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because they're stuck in there. Like it blows my mind when I think, like I'm the same, I've got some mates that I haven't spoken to for years and for up until that point in my life, like you would, you were talking almost daily, yeah. But and then it gets to a point where you're like I got no interest in what's happened on the news or that you broke up with your second girlfriend for the week, or you couldn't like, whatever it is but like, yeah, negativity just it holds everything back.
Speaker 2:and even like I think it, like, because I'm so focused on that now and being positive like I to me, mate, every day that my eyes open is the best day ever. Yeah, like it doesn't matter what I've got to do for that day, how hard that day is going to be. Reality is I'm alive and, yeah, I get to make the decisions on how my life pans out. So, yeah, and I think back to like even my teenage years and my first jobs and starting my business and then having all those years of struggles and every single thing that went wrong and happened to me was all because of what I was telling myself the energy I was putting out there, the people I was hanging around, because I was taken on like, a lot of the time, when you, you're so caught up in it, not only it's not only you that's giving out all this negative energy, but you're absorbing it from all the people you're hanging around.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's funny the deeper, you get into it. You know energy. You almost feel a bad energy. Get into the room, you kind of go oh yeah like I'm not, who is it?
Speaker 1:who's brought this? Because they're, they're out, they're gone. So, and I do that to a point where I almost my partner would agree if I said alienate myself to like, if I don't get a great vibe from someone there, they're like, they're done. Like I'm not, you're over there, I'm out of here, I'm, I'm doing my own thing, yeah, but it's powerful stuff, isn't it? Yeah, for sure. And you get to the like, I get to the point where I would rather be off doing my own thing solo than hanging out with bad energy and feeling tense and feeling, you know, anxious about the whole thing 100%, 100% I'm just trying to think of the name it I I had to go.
Speaker 2:I did my back. I was at the farm doing some work the other weekend and like I've always had a bad back but like I've managed to look after it really well for years now. Yeah, because I am looking after myself a lot better. But there's been a few things going on in in life and business and been butting heads with a couple of people and yeah, I was working up on the farm and like I literally got out of the excavator and went to move a stick that had got stuck in the tracks and my back went like the worst ever and like I literally stopped what I was doing and I was late in the day.
Speaker 2:Anyway, it was like quarter seven or something went to, went over to camp and I almost had tears in my eyes and I was like I'm gonna have to, like I'm in the middle of the night, I'm gonna have to ring someone and like I don't know if I'm gonna be able to drive all the way back to prison tomorrow.
Speaker 2:Like, anyway, I got home, didn't feel too bad, drove home, didn't really sleep that night and then rang this lady that I go, like I've been to her on and off for years, like she does a bit of massage and all this type of stuff and we've always gone on pretty well and she's like you've been going all right, like you actually haven't been here for nearly two and a half years and yeah. So, yeah, well, I've been doing what you tell me to do. Anyway, she's getting, she's giving the massage and we started having this conversation. Like she, like my wife, goes there, my two girls go and see her as well, but she's into a lot of different alternative type stuff, reiki and things like that, yeah yeah, and I'm trying so hard to think of the name.
Speaker 2:It was she, it was best. Do you remember what she was like? Bio-anergetic systemization technique or something like that? Right, so it's a short name, but it was all with it. It was all about energy. So, like she's almost finished my massage and I'm like man, my back isn't getting any better. And she started like she was putting one hand on my back one that's hand on my stomach and she's like you, have you been feeling all right? Like your stomach's really moving around. I was like you know, I feel all right. She's like you've got a lot of.
Speaker 2:And she started basically telling me what was happening in my life and told me, like your back's done this because this bad energy is built up so much that this had to happen to you, otherwise you're not going to figure out what this is. And it was unbelievable, man, and like, she went on to tell me stuff about, like things that are going on in business that I am trying to work through. One of our daughters is having a bit of trouble at school. Like, gave me advice on what she can do, like, and she knew nothing, like we hadn't talked about this. Yeah, and so I'm open to all that sort of stuff now and I actually like the whole way home from that. I come home, had a conversation with my wife, camille, and like just for 48 hours like I just could not stop thinking about what she'd been telling me and, um, what have we got here Shaz just found us for?
Speaker 2:so, um, bio energetic synchronization technique is a mind and body structure healing, chiropractic adjustment utilizing zero force and instead uses electromagnetic treatment that helps balance your mind, body and soul wow um, but yeah, she was telling me how our body stores energy and, you like, every time we have a negative situation or a confrontation or something that upsets us, yeah, it could be anything our body holds that yeah, and don't release.
Speaker 1:It becomes disease, disease.
Speaker 2:So yeah, yeah yeah, and so she actually after, like before we ended that session, she actually went back and told me a period in my life that I have to do some homework on right and figure out what it was that was disturbing me, and and she's told me, like, if I can figure that out, so I'm gonna go and see, like Justin, yeah, in a breath. I've been doing a few sessions with him and I've some of the shit that's come out or I've been doing the breath with him's been amazing, yeah, so I'm gonna go and see him and work on this because she's told me that, um, if I can release this one thing that she believes is like giving me a lot of tension in my shoulders and my hip yeah it, I'll just skyrocket, she says, really holding me back.
Speaker 2:So I just got all the time in the world for that sort of stuff and definitely and like I said years ago, mate, anyone that had talked to me about that stuff I would have gone. You're a fucking idiot crazy.
Speaker 1:What are you on what?
Speaker 2:are you smoking before you come here? Like um, but it works for sure, yeah. And like that week after that, like I come home, had that conversation with Camille, like thought about it hard for like 48 hours, like that entire week, mate, I just felt like I was floating. Yeah, um, I was like this is unreal, like I've. I felt like I had clarity, I felt like I had direction, definitely. So, yeah, what, like you mentioned, you've had some sort of therapy. What's um?
Speaker 1:oh no, I've actually just seen a therapist, but I've also, yeah, we've done a lot of breath work as well, like, um, there's a few places that do like a DMT breath work where, yeah, you know, you get your pineal gland going and sort of going a bit of a natural trip, I guess. Yeah, so we do a lot of breath work. We do it, we generally. That sounds all right. Where do we do that? Um, there's a guy that does it, called Dr Espen. Actually, we did a little weekend, like a three-day thing, with him and they finish with this hour and a half DMT breath work session. Actually, justin will know a little bit about it. Justin's aware of Dr Espen and Joe Dispenser does a similar one as well. Yeah, um, but yeah, it's um, it's pretty loose, like some of the stories you hear after it. Like I've never I haven't had an experience like some of these people. Some of these people come up the wildest things and you're just like, did you actually take something?
Speaker 2:Or is this just?
Speaker 1:purely breath work. That's a loose story, but yeah, I definitely. We find, after we've done breath work and you know, a bit of meditation and stuff, like a million times better. Even my anxiety and stress is to the weak lower, like as a builder you're operated at a fairly high stress level anyway Just because of the moving parts. But, mate, we do that Like. Just my base level for the week is I'm already a lot more grounded.
Speaker 2:It's amazing stuff. I'm definitely a huge fan of it and again, hopefully, by talking about it on this podcast, it gets more people dropping their ego and having a crack at different things. I've done a lot of the group sessions with Justin and some other people. Now I've done a few one-on-ones. I've had some really like I've got rid of some really good stuff with Justin. We went down myself and five, four mates went down and did that Johannes's Breathless Expeditions weekend down in the Snowy Mountains. It was an unbelievable weekend. Like recommend it to anyone. I really want to go back next year. He does a men's one. This one was a mixed group.
Speaker 1:Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:And so he uses ice baths, saunas, breath work, but the ice baths turned into like we sat in a minus three degrees frozen creek for I think we meant to nine minutes. So you, like your teachers, you use your breath to control your body and it was just. It was amazing. But the mates that come with me? So we've created a little bit of a group that every year we try and do something that's a bit out of our comfort zone, and the other guys know that I've got into doing a bit of this stuff and just give me shit about it all the time. And one of them sent me a message saying hey, I've booked this, this is what we're doing this year.
Speaker 2:And I basically had a quick look at it, like sending a message straight back saying I've just booked it, Awesome, Like. And he was joking. Yeah, I was just taking the piss, and I was like no, we're doing it now.
Speaker 1:Let me guess he had the most benefit.
Speaker 2:So two of them they were the biggest skeptics and guys that you would never think that you would talk into it. Yeah, and they had the most incredible experiences and left that weekend like just on a new level. And these are. These are two guys that have done incredibly well in business, in life, in family and like you would think that they are on cloud nine. But they released a lot of shit and left that weekend telling the group what they're going to do and what they're going to work on and like the whole room just like was tearing man.
Speaker 1:It was unreal. Can I imagine, if they were open to it, going into it, how much better it would have been?
Speaker 2:Well, one of them has gone back and done a bit more and he's, he's into it. Yeah, I think it's something that everybody should have a crack at and like. So one thing that we've, we do that's very different with live, life, build and like I tell people now, like we're not, if you want the Lamborghinis and mansions or the Lati day, like we're not the community for you, yeah, it's not that like we'll make you profitable. We've got all the systems, processes, templates, documents, everything to do that. But for us, success is all about like freedom and having a well old machine, but like mindset and spending time with family, and like earning money so that you can actually go away for four or five or six weeks a year and your phone doesn't ring because your business runs really well. But yeah.
Speaker 2:And so we really focus like we've got a mindset expert. Now we got a leadership expert, mental health and well being. Because from my experience and the hundreds of builders we've had now we've realized, like you, we could give you a full instruction manual like down the pages, every system, every process, everything that you need to run an incredible building business. That might get you running a great business for three months, six months a year, but if you're not right mentally and physically and work on your personal you're just going to go back on that roller coaster 100%.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, it's a full, full approach. Yeah, there's no point driving around Lamborghini at 180 kilos eating maccas and going I've done it, I did it. Yeah, yeah, on your own, yeah yeah.
Speaker 2:No, that's, I'm really. That's really interesting, mate. I didn't realize you're into it. I knew that you put in in your nature into the manifestation stuff, but it's good. So how regularly do you do a bit of breath work? Do you just take time every now and then to like like one thing I do if I pull up to a meeting that I'm a little bit nervous about, like I'll just take two minutes and just sit in the truck and just yeah, just breathe, take a few.
Speaker 1:Breath work playlist that I just throw on and go through the process. That, generally eight to 15 minutes, and then, yeah, here and there, like I'd like to be better at it, here and there I I. Every morning I wake up and I'll do a meditation. It's more, I'm reminded by my partner, candace, to do it, which is what I go. Oh, yeah, shit, you're right, that's right, I'm going to do it, otherwise I just caught up and go straight into it. I'm going, yeah, but even I go, yep, you're right and I do it. And yeah, it's sort of gets you just grounded and ready to go. Yeah, Ideally, sunlight first up in the morning is a good start as well.
Speaker 2:Unbelievable. I get so much from just getting outside or, like I said, waking up in the morning, being grateful that you're alive and just seeing the sun come up it's best time of the day. So what do you do? You're obviously still staying pretty fit. Yep what Occasionally.
Speaker 1:This is just a product of 10 to 15 years of training. I sort of don't really train a whole lot anymore. I probably would like to train more than I do. I just, you know, I sort of get caught up and one of those people that puts everyone else first and then I go all right, what have I got time for myself? Which this year I've actually sort of turned that on its head a little bit and started pushing myself first, so like I'll do this first and then we can move on to sorting everyone else out, and I've found that's been a massive change.
Speaker 2:Do you feel that you can help more people because you're looking after yourself first?
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I'm not so tight Like before that I was going. I'll go to the gym tonight and I would work till 10 o'clock at night and then go. Well, it's too late. I'm going to go to bed, wake up tired, grumpy, you know. Then I'm bringing those that energy that I don't believe on anyone bringing, and you know so it took a little while and I was kind of like no, not a fan. So I've sort of flipped it all and changed a lot around and you know, like I really only got off the tools properly and I still do a few days a week and like I just took on it. Well, not just, but a couple of months ago I took on a job I shouldn't have. It's going to put me under pressure up into Christmas, but I learned from those mistakes every year.
Speaker 2:Why shouldn't you take it on Too busy or not?
Speaker 1:We're too busy. We just didn't like I'm essentially doing that project on my own while my staff are at the other jobs, like while trying to run everything else, and which is just it wasn't a smart idea. But I know the client. They were sort of they needed it done, they were selling a house and had to be out and it's going to be a great project. But it's just a lot more hours and stress that I didn't need Like we were functioning nicely moving into Christmas and I just went.
Speaker 1:Oh, let's make it really difficult.
Speaker 2:You let someone else's priority become yours? Yeah exactly.
Speaker 1:So once again, it's another lesson where I go well, I won't do that again, so that's all I take out of that. I go, yeah, it's going to be really hard right now, but we're going to get it done and, yeah, we'll move from there.
Speaker 2:So what are you doing to put yourself first? Like, is that a like scheduling time in for yourself?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I've been trying to schedule the mornings for myself so I can do a bit of breath work, meditation, gym, walk the dog Like a lot of people don't, back onto the you know successful and Lamborghini Like a lot of people don't realize. But I walk with the dog in my work boots Like they're a fixture, like I got dressed up for you guys today. But generally.
Speaker 1:I'm in my work boots all until I shower. The gym's the only time I don't wear them because I'm not allowed to. But yeah, like I, yeah, I just train, I think keep healthy and for me it's a mental release to go to the gym. I don't really I'm not into how much I can lift or do this or do that. I just it's about going through the process and just you know I'm doing something I've scheduled for myself and moving through it. But yeah, that's. It's not like I'm an experienced sort of guy as well, like I don't buy things. We go on experiences. We go on experience things and have a weekend out in nature and things like that. Like that's sort of more our vibe. Like I say to the boys all the time I'll never be in a Lamborghini while you guys struggle, cause it, like we'll protect everyone, sort of things.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's awesome, like your team your building in just from what you're talking about, like you're building an incredible culture and vibe. Like I think it's. It's really important, isn't it, that your team see you. Like if you want to be a leader, like you've got to lead from the front. So if you put yourself out there, try new things. Like I don't push anything on my team, but I give my team opportunities, like if they want to come to breathwork, if they want me to organize a session, or if they want to grow in one way or another, like it's always out there, it's a choice if they want to do it or not.
Speaker 1:And we're the same, even like, like we get a few companies that sort of reach out to push their product and take some footage on sites and stuff like that and like. So my fiance, candice, she's an actor, that's her main sort of dream goal and she's pretty successful and she's a director now as well. So, like, we're used to being around cameras, we're used to doing all that sort of stuff. Not the cold mate. Yeah, yeah, I'm actually on TV with John and the first at the moment too. Hey, what's up? Get ready, queensland. It's like getting ready for storm season.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I did it over a year ago and it's just rolled over again. So, oh, we'll keep an eye out for that, yeah, yeah, so, actually as a tradesman, so I'm doing the hive is. It's pretty easy one. But yeah, we sort of give our guys the option Do you want to be on camera, do you not? Like, if you are on camera, this is what you get, like, because we did a thing with JetPilot and they gave everyone bulk gear for being a part of it and helping them get footage. It's still an option, like they don't have to do it. It's just that we're comfortable in front of cameras. So, give the option. And yeah, young Cam, he's on a billboard or posters or somewhere for a work west or all around Australia. Yeah, they liked one of the photos of him and you never told us that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, so he's been circulating more than bloody. I have Didn't even try. He was just smiling working away and, yeah, they loved it. Oh yeah, yeah, we're the same. We're just trying to give opportunity for everyone to do what we do, or you know what we've seen benefit from. We think they could benefit, but if they're not into it, they're not into it or they're not ready. They're one point. They'll be ready.
Speaker 2:There's a lot of value in thinking outside the box. In there, yeah, yeah, definitely, because you just, you never know Like. That's a perfect example. You just, you never, ever know where something's going to lead, who's going to see it. Yeah, like yeah, that's that's pretty good.
Speaker 1:The modeling gig I just fell into. I was literally my partner's friend was launching her own dog harnesses and collars and things like that and they needed a male. So I had three females and they needed a male model. I'd never done a thing in my life before and I was just taking Candice there and yeah, they were like we need a male, Like can you do it? I think it was the night before they said, can you do it? I was like I'll give it a crack. And then I, yeah, apparently the photographer was like yeah, he was a pretty big deal, and then I've actually worked with him several times now, so it kind of just flowed on from there.
Speaker 2:Well, mate, you're pretty smart looking blank, so like you're going to, get a few broken noses here.
Speaker 1:I was all right till I broke it a few times. My own player broke my nose.
Speaker 2:So, mate, where, what's where to from here? Like what's the plans for frameology? So you mentioned before that your last year. You're sort of considering, like is this all worth it? Like, is it worth it?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think so. I think you know, with the rollercoasters of construction, you sort of, yeah, you feel things at certain times where you do need to take a step back and you know, ground yourself and go. Was I just in a high stress environment then, and that's why I come up with that which evidently I was very stressed. We were sort of, yeah, finishing one. We had one, that was, we had ready to go and it pulled out on us. So then, you know, we were sort of looking down the barrel of struggling cash flow and things like that. We ended up signing another one. It was all good, like it wasn't a big deal, but I was just operating at like two months of high stress and then, yeah, we pretty well got rid of a few guys from that team and then that's what we brought in you.
Speaker 1:And I think from then we've sort of started to head upwards and like giving people. Like I had a real control issue in the beginning where I needed to be in full control and I wouldn't sort of let anyone take it. I would like micromanage them into. All. Right, this is how we got to do this. This is are you right? Do you want me to do it? Is this on site, on site office, whatever it was? I was like no, no, I'm doing it, and I slowly sort of started to release that and go, no, no, you're ready, you can do it and encourage. I think since I started doing that, the pressure has just released enormously.
Speaker 2:What do you think made that? Because this is something that comes up all the time. It's one of the hardest things for business owners tradies builders to step back.
Speaker 1:The thing that I can pinpoint it to and for me this might not be anyone else, but because you come up through the trade and you are doing the work and you are the face and it almost brings like a. Your value is based on what you can do with your hands and the product you can show at the end of the day and things like that Whereas I got to a point where I was like my product is not actually that house, my product is that team plus that, plus that. That made that. So it was yeah. For me it was like I just had to go. You can't put the nail belt on and work all day and then, when the client comes, go. I'll see. Look, I got my hammer like I'm chipping away at it. So for me it was yeah, releasing that.
Speaker 2:That's another thing, isn't it? Like a lot of builders think that the client expects to see them on site swinging the hammer, throwing the frames up. That's never going to have a truly successful building business.
Speaker 1:doing that, I was caught in that mindset, like even what? June, we did a modular home at 1770 and, I mind you, we had to be. We were only there for a short time. We had. We were there for a month and we had to just knock this out of the park and get it done. And we did, we got it done but it took everyone.
Speaker 1:But I was still on the tools up until June July and I still occasionally have to jump in and punch things out here and there. And yeah, I think that while I was on the tools, I was watching, like I was sort of just learning and watching what all the guys were doing and sort of seeing, like because we were sort of all split up all over the shop doing different bits and pieces and I was sort of looking over, going, oh, they nailed that and I wasn't even. I wasn't even a part of that part. So I think that's when it clicked for me. I went oh, I've been stopping them from actually getting better to help me. So that's kind of where we've gone now we started. Just, you know, you can handle that, you can handle that.
Speaker 2:It's a big trust thing, isn't it? Yeah, there's a lot of trust because obviously there's a lot on the line your profitability, your business, wasting materials, doing things multiple times. There's a lot to consider.
Speaker 1:We still have control in terms of like we run, Build a Trend and we require daily logs every day. We have photos every day, like everything still so if I don't get there that day, I can just go yep, okay, they've done that. They've done that, Nice job.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And yeah, but basically releasing all that pressure that I'm putting on myself and giving it to other people has really made a massive difference and like I've got a construction manager. I actually grew up with my construction manager now and he went to America and did a bunch of mansions and all this sort of thing and he's come back and I sort of spent 12 to 15 months sort of getting him trained up into a position where he can actually run sites if I'm not there, and like we're actually nailing it right now to a point where I could go away for a couple of weeks and he would have it covered as long as we're not operating at too many jobs that he can handle. Like he's sort of well, any supervisor should really not have 20 houses, but as long as we're within that constraint, like I can go away a month, six weeks if I wanted to, and he's super capable of running the show. Yeah.
Speaker 2:It's an incredible feeling when you know you've got a team like that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, definitely. But, like I said, a year ago, I was thinking, you know, this might not be the case and he was working with us at that point and he was already sort of bringing him through into running things. But I was still just like I'm just not sure. But that was me trying to control and going, oh, I'm the face, whereas now I'm like this logo is the face. I don't need to be the face, I just handle it and get it to a point. And then these guys I trust that they're going to take it from there, as long as I value them, or girls, as long as I value them, and they know they're valued and you know, and it's not huge things you don't have to pay them $200,000 a year, like it's little things have a barbecue.
Speaker 1:We get them cakes for their birthday and they're just over the moon. They've never had it before. Things like that, Like you know, this doesn't take much for appreciation. Like people feel grateful that they're here.
Speaker 2:Respect.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2:Give people respect they deserve. It's like the other hard thing. I think you've just got to realize that if you aren't there all the time, then there is certain things that aren't going to get done as fast as what you would do then. But that's just. That's just part of being a business owner You're always going to bust your balls and do whatever it takes. Yeah.
Speaker 1:The construction manager, aiden, he's actually more of a hard-ass than I am, to be honest. He's like ruthless, so he's probably more ruthless than me. Like sometimes I just look at him and I go mate you serious, which is great though, like that's perfect. But yeah, sometimes he pushes the boundaries a little bit where we kind of go, oh, that's actually not possible to get done. He's like, yeah, it is, we're going to make it happen, yeah, so yeah, it's good.
Speaker 2:I really, like you touched on before, mate, that you're all about experiences not about things Like I think that's a especially in this day and age, when everyone's connected to social media all the time, like experiences are, like making memories is really, really important, isn't it?
Speaker 1:Definitely I'm a big one on quality time. Like it's if you're a mate of mine and we're pretty close, and like even my partner, it's quality time. We're together, we're doing something. We're yeah, we're not, you know, going for. We're not. Well, I don't know going to a restaurant and dropping $1,000 on food just so that we're seen there or whatever. Like it's, we're not about that. We'll go out to nature and hide for three days with no phone. Yeah, people go. Well, you've been.
Speaker 2:Disconnect to reconnect. Just take a dog and see you later. Yeah, I absolutely love it, really appreciate you taking the time out to come and have a chat. I'm always yeah, like I said, I've been looking forward to it because I knew you would have a lot to offer. I think you need to give yourself a massive pat on the back, like you're doing very well. You're definitely a deserving winner of the Rising Star award, like I think you're. You're going to be someone in the industry that's definitely going to help pay the pass for new ways and younger people to come through. Like, like I said, you're you're a apprentice when he was on because he just he won the apprentice of the year.
Speaker 2:Like mate. He spoke incredibly highly of you. So, yeah, really appreciate your time. Keep doing what you're doing. I really appreciate you opening up and talking about all the personal stuff and the breast working stuff, because I think everyone, males, females, girls, boys, whatever it benefits everybody For sure yeah, drop the ego. Don't worry about what other people think. Like give stuff a crack. And yet people like yourself telling your stories will will really resonate with people. So really appreciate your time, mate.
Speaker 1:Thanks, man Appreciate it.
Speaker 2:All right guys. Well, if you enjoyed that episode, make sure you like, subscribe, follow the links and, yeah, check us out and we'll see you on the next one. Are you ready to build smarter, live better and enjoy?
Speaker 1:life and head over to livelikebuildcom. Forward slash elevate to get started.
Speaker 2:Everything discussed during the level up podcast with me, dwayne Pierce, is based solely on my own personal experiences and those experiences of my guests. The information, opinions and recommendations presented in this podcast are for general information only, and any reliance on the information provided in this podcast is done at your own risk. We recommend that you attain your own professional advice in respect to the topics discussed during this podcast.