Managing 2 Kids a Dog and a Building Business.

From the trials of the Global Financial Crisis to the pride of winning the Rising Star Award, Todd of Alternative Constructions embodies the spirit of perseverance and the love for building that can inspire us all. His candid accounts of early challenges and the influential mentors who helped shape his career path offer a blueprint for turning setbacks into triumphs.

Entering the wood-scented workshop of carpentry, Todd and I explore the fine art of the trade, reminiscing about the demanding apprenticeships that built our foundations. We exchange stories of seasoned builders, the evolution of mental health awareness in the industry, and the importance of a well-organized work vehicle—a reminder that craftsmanship extends far beyond the construction site. For anyone with sawdust in their veins, this episode is a heartfelt nod to the hidden intricacies of building, from the care of tools to the strategic sharing of knowledge that fortifies our community.

Wrapping up our robust discussion, Todd sheds light on the keystones of success in construction: communication and organization. He reveals how setting clear expectations and learning from each project can solidify client relationships and enhance business operations. We also tackle the pressing issues facing today's master builders, such as labor shortages and material scarcity, offering practical solutions and highlighting the power of a supportive industry community. If you're looking to construct a legacy in the building industry or just appreciate the craft, join us as we lay the groundwork for excellence, one story at a time.

We're on a mission to elevate the professionalism of the residential construction industry, and help everyone enjoy building and renovating homes.

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Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:00

one of those people that I absolutely hated for three and a half years, or for you know of my four-year apprenticeship. But then the last six months, you then realize he's just pushing you to become a better person. And then in the last six months you regret not learning more.

Speaker 2: 0:22

G'day guys. Welcome back to another episode of Level Up. We are back in the shed this afternoon for another cracking episode. This one's a little bit of a different one. The guest we have with us this afternoon we actually can't figure out how he's ended up in this seat, but he follows us on social media. I actually think he's been recommended to us by another good builder mate of mine. But anyway, he's a cracking guy and I can't wait to get stuck into his story. He's had a little bit of a challenging road to get to where he is now, but it's all been worthwhile, because last year he took out the Rising Star Award for his region and for Queensland. So that was definitely a huge achievement. But a big, warm welcome to Todd from Alternative Constructions. How are you?

Speaker 1: 1:05

mate. Yeah, brilliant, thank you. No, it's a pleasure to be here and, yeah, can't wait to get amongst the stories.

Speaker 2: 1:12

Yeah, mate, I'm looking forward to it. So you're mates with Craig Stewart, stewart Owned Renovations. So him and I are very good mates. Uh, he takes advantage of my other businesses now with quotas and live life building stuff. But, um, he speaks pretty highly of you so I'm keen to get stuck in the conversation. I'll have to give him that carton, so. But, um, mate, so you're a builder. Yes, um, how long you've been building for?

Speaker 1: 1:42

um, been a Been, a licensed builder, for seven years now. Well, this is our eighth year, but we've been doing our own thing wholly and solely since 2018. Yeah, so yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:57

So, mate, tell us about your challenges, because I think I'd like to. When we first started this podcast, we used to always ask everyone well, tell us your story, where did you come from? And half an hour later, we'd still be sitting here and they'd be telling me where they grew up, where they went to school, what grade they finished and when they got suspended and all this type of stuff.

Speaker 2: 2:14

And so, yeah, we've definitely changed the way we go about the podcast. But I'd like to go back to you and how you got started in the industry, because you tried to get in the industry right when the GFC sort of hit, so you had a pretty challenging time, definitely, and I'd like to hear your story because I think, well, I know lots of people will think they want to do something or try something and then they might get one or two knockbacks and that's it, they're out, they go and take the easy road. So tell us about how you got into it.

Speaker 1: 2:47

Yeah, no, that's all good and yeah, exactly right, I think, if I wind it all the way back, if you asked a six-year-old Todd, what do you want it to be, it was a builder, dead set one, you know. I built tree houses and cubbies and rafts and everything along those lines. Where does that come from? Is there someone in the family? I could have been fourth generation plumber, to be honest, but I don't want to play with the literal stuff, so a trade background has always been part of our family, I guess. And working outside and working with your hands and just getting it done necessary. But, yeah, finished, finished high school and I'd actually had a university degree booked. Um, I'd gone away from from that building aspect and I took a gap year. What were you going to do at uni? Uh, zoology, actually turns out, though I don't really like animals, so go go figure. Um, you know I'm not. I'm not one to hang a snake around my neck or anything like that like I love them.

Speaker 2: 3:47

I won't. I won't kill them or anything like that. But so what were you going to go into?

Speaker 1: 3:52

something I don't know I think, um, it was probably a bit of parental pressure. You know, they didn't want to do the construction industry. Um, you know, dad had his own own plumbing business but turned out, you know, I don't know how long he ran it for, but he went down a plumbing. So you know, he's a plumbing certifier, um, now retired, but yeah, so it's. It's probably that aspect. But, yeah, it took a gap year and in that in that time, so my, my girlfriend at the time, who is, who is now my wife, her father, her father's best mate's friend, was the builder. So it was that, you know, six links of command and or kevin bacon, so to speak, and yeah, he, he gave me a job. So he was at noosa or he was based at korean, so I traveled, you know, half an hour, 40 minutes every every day, but I, I loved it and I just took it. As you know, it was a job at that point in time, but it kindled something pretty deep.

Speaker 1: 4:50

So this wasn't your apprenticeship.

Speaker 2: 4:51

No, so that was just a gap year. This was just like labouring.

Speaker 1: 4:53

So labouring and in that time I was still looking for other jobs. So you know, cootsie, shane Coots, so shout out to shane coots. So he um, I've heard that name is he a builder? Yeah, he's a builder. So that's, that's the builder. So he, he was winding up and he just put on two apprentices at that point in time. So his work was winding up and I got a job at a mill in town.

Speaker 1: 5:17

So I I then worked for another year in that respect and worked at the mill, worked for a labour hire company, I planted trees in the forestry, I sprayed weeds. I did absolutely anything and everything. And in that I realised what I didn't want to do and what I did want to do, and that was be a be a carpenter. So that passion was then rekindled, um, and that was my goal and my focus. So, so I think that was about yeah, 08, something along those lines.

Speaker 1: 5:47

So I reached back out to Shane, but he wasn't looking for anyone at that point in time. So I had got some work with another local builder. That only lasted a couple of months because, yeah, as you mentioned, it came into the GFC, so it was pretty hard hitting. So I remember sending out emails and resumes and phone calls to pretty much every builder I could find in the phone book it was the yellow phone book back then, so showing the age a little bit, and no one was putting anyone on. So I just had to keep going, to be honest, and eventually I probably annoyed Shane that much that he got sick of me ringing and just decided to give me another job. So I spent another year then labouring for him and same thing just hassled him non-stop and I think they were giving away a really good incentive at the time and that's the reason why he ended up putting me on. But it was just that I never gave up on it, to be honest.

Speaker 2: 6:50

Well, I think there's lots of good messages in just your story so far. Like you've got to be consistent and committed, don't you? Definitely Like you can't, especially now it's getting harder and harder, like so we've literally in the last three weeks, uh, we've put on a well, he's on his trial, but we started a new guy. Yep, definitely like fresh out of school just finished.

Speaker 2: 7:14

yeah just finished um high school last year. So like 17, yeah, like scrawny little guy, um, and definitely not the type of person that I would normally be looking for. Yeah, but, mate, this kid, like I'll take my hat off to him. Like he, he reached out to us multiple times during the year last year, sent us emails, kept handing me to see, like, asked me if he could come and just have a chat. Yeah, um, and I sort of just kept pushing it aside. Then he asked if he could just come and watch guys on site, like um, anyway, long story short, we ended up getting him outside. He met my supervisor, met with a couple of carpenters, spent an hour or two on site, had a good chat, um, I actually asked him to talk to the other guys. Um, anyway, we put him on.

Speaker 2: 8:02

He's on trial, he's, he's. He's slow, he's um, but he's just so keen. Yeah, like he's asking questions and I think, like I'm pretty confident, we're going to get him up to speed and he'll be a good kid. But he's the first kid in a in years and years that I have been approached like that. Like normally they'll send an email or whatever, they'll reach out and that's the last you hear of them and it's just. I don't know if it's their mum and dad pushing them to do it or what it is.

Speaker 1: 8:34

Well, exactly, and now, being on the other side of the fence, I, you know, if I get an email from a mum and dad, you know it needs to be emails. They need to be hassling you calls like that interest needs to be shown and that's, yeah, that's something that I feel like can't be taught.

Speaker 2: 8:51

Yeah, you know, you've got to uh, you've, you've got to be keen. Yeah, like for me I've mentioned a lot of times on the podcast like a lot of, for me the most important thing is attitude. Yep, like I can teach skills hands down, but I can't change an attitude, yep.

Speaker 1: 9:06

Definitely.

Speaker 2: 9:07

And I think that's an important lesson for everyone, because if you're, if you you might have the best worker in the world, but if they got a shit attitude, you just button your head against the wall all the time. But, like the other thing, I picked up from what you were just saying, like you were going to go to uni and do something you fucking didn't like. Just because you, I was getting pushed, you were getting pushed. And this is something I'm really passionate about now and I'll say it again. But I believe that 99.9% of people on this planet are not themselves. Yeah, they are just going down the garden path, following in footsteps or what's attitudes and beliefs and stories they tell themselves and all this shit.

Speaker 2: 9:50

Um, like, I know so many people that are doing jobs they fucking hate. Yeah, but it's because they've been pushed by family to do those jobs.

Speaker 1: 9:59

Yeah and I well, I reckon like the only reason I'm still going so you know through COVID Home Builder materials you know that's a whole other podcast, but is because of how passionate I am for carpentry. I love it you know, it's yeah, hand planes and you know saws, and just being on site building something with your hands is remarkable.

Speaker 2: 10:26

So that's what I love about it.

Speaker 2: 10:27

I'll uh I'll piss half the half the industry off by saying what I'm going to say next, but I don't believe there's many good carpenters out there anymore yeah, no, I I agree with you in in that regard um, but just to clarify what I mean like to me, like what, from what I see these days, and it like it fucking shits me. Like you see these guys on instagram stuff that have these big carpenter gangs, yep, and like they're bulk higher, they send 10, 20 carpenters out to a block, of block of 10 hours or whatever. They smash in a day. They smash it up. They're using clout guns to nail cladding on. They wouldn't know how to sharpen a chisel or a saw blade if they were forced to. Everything's just slap it up, get out of there, get in get out, get paid.

Speaker 2: 11:15

Yeah, and we've got a really good podcast episode coming up actually with Craig, and the whole podcast is about skills that have been lost. I think, yeah, and Craig's the man for it. Definitely he loves it. He's a godfather of building. He loves it. Yeah, but that's what I mean when I say there's. I don't believe there's. I think carpentry is going to become a lost skill. Yeah, because to me, carpentry isn't just about being able to turn up, mark a frame out, build the frame, stand it up, like it's. It's all the craftsmanship behind the scenes. It's maintaining your tools. It's sharpening your tools. It's, um, looking after all your gear. It's having your truck or your trailer set up right. It's it's having your, your nail bag all laid out efficiently so you're not wasting time grabbing shit like, yeah, like this might seem like a silly one, but how many people like I used to get abused like if you couldn't have a full handful of clouts and being able to feed them through your fingers?

Speaker 1: 12:16

put the nails in the right way.

Speaker 2: 12:18

Yeah, that was, that was shown everyone's just pull one nail out, put it in.

Speaker 1: 12:22

Pull one nail out, put it in no, he was, yeah, he, and I'm thankful for him now because you know you'd see him come to site in a cloud, you know, cloud of dust. He was a bullet at the gate and if your hands weren't moving efficiently for him, you got to spray. Yeah, you know, and it was, you know, not a deal at the time, but it turns you into the person you are now and you know we yeah, he was great and our leading carpenter as well. He was the same thing and one of those people that I absolutely hated for three and a half years, or for you know of my four-year apprenticeship. But then the last six months, you then realize he's just pushing you to become a better person. And then in the last six months, you regret he's just pushing you to become a better person and then in the last six months, you regret not learning more yeah, off him.

Speaker 2: 13:10

I was the same man, I, so I actually didn't finish my apprenticeship. I actually I left. I left my first boss because I just I just couldn't handle the the constant yelling and and pushing every single day. And then I went to another guy and then he was similar. But my problem with him was he would literally just leave me on site to bust my balls and then abuse me Like ask me, why didn't?

Speaker 1: 13:37

I get shit done.

Speaker 2: 13:39

And I'm like fuck mate, I'm trying to put up 24 by 12 soffit sheets on my own and get them in so kids these days wouldn't have a clue. No, mate, I used to have to put up 24 by 12 soffit sheets into the plastic joiner strip and nail them up on my own, on your own, and if the boss come back and I didn't have enough done, I'd get a view, so I had to come up with all sorts of contraptions.

Speaker 1: 13:59

Mate to hold the sheet up and help me out make a jig even making jigs.

Speaker 1: 14:09

Yeah, you know, like, um, that's a dying, dying art. Or you know, you get all the pre pre-made jigs. And I remember ian, who our, who, our leading hand was. I remember I can't remember exactly what he said one day, but he was like I'll go home and make jigs, yeah, and it was that realization that you know, carpentry or work doesn't finish. You know, between six and four or something along those lines, if, if, you can then do something to speed you up on the next two or three jobs. That's, that's part of the industry. And, like you said about maintenance and sharp chisels, because if you're and I think because I finished my time, they went subcontracting. And same thing, if you don't have your things maintained or you don't have sharp tools, it costs you money, yeah, at the end of the day. So you can see or I think I can see a big difference in same thing. Piss off the industry. Who's worked for the money and who's been on hourly rate yeah, because there's that, there's that stark contrast between the two.

Speaker 1: 15:02

Yeah, but it but it's now finding that you know that line between you, know how quickly and efficiently you can do things, but then without losing the subtle touches that make it a great trade.

Speaker 2: 16:43

But I like I think about it all the time now, like I absolutely I'd love to go back and, if they're still alive, like see my old bosses and thank them for how hard they pushed me and what they did to me, because I wouldn't be where I am or the person I am or the trader I am if I, if I hadn't have been put through all that and I know it's these like now, with all the anxiety, depression, mental health stuff and all that, like it's. It's challenging because, like now, you push someone too hard and they break down and they have a week off.

Speaker 2: 17:15

yep, um, we've been, yeah, been there like I get it, I'm I'm a big advocate for mental health, but, um, yeah, I just think like, because there was plenty of times I would have easily quit my apprenticeship. Yeah, if, um, but it wasn't just my boss and that gave me a hard time. It was the old man as well, sure thing. Oh, and not well, everyone around me, like you, just had to work hard like, get over it.

Speaker 1: 17:39

Like, and that's, and that's what the industry's been for forever and a day, yeah, so what are we?

Speaker 2: 17:45

going to have in the future? Like what do? Like when things get harder, people just gonna not go to work for a few days. Where's it all going?

Speaker 1: 17:54

Exactly that's the worrying thing, and kids, and trying to instill in our children, our young children, that not everything goes your way but you've got to pull your. It's not necessarily your fault or not necessarily the teacher's fault or anything along those lines, lines but pull your socks up and and learn something from it and and change, change next time so the bigger the reward in it, like the heart, the heart of the lesson, the bigger the reward.

Speaker 2: 18:24

But, um, yeah, look, I think the industry's. It's going to be very interesting to see where it sort of plays out over the next 20 to 40 years. Yeah, look, I don't know If I piss people off about the carpentry comment. It's so bad. Reach out, come on the podcast, let's have a debate about it. Definitely have a chat. Well, I think.

Speaker 1: 18:45

I can't remember. It was one of your podcasts I was listening to and one of the fellows said the stats that we've got 40 people leaving a year but only seven coming in. So not only that knowledge, but the replacement. We've got the Olympics.

Speaker 2: 19:00

We've got massive land developments and housing developments happening, even just like I just read something the other day I was talking to a few of our subbies about it this area where we are here, moreton Bay Regional Council apparently I'm not sure if it's just been done or it's happening they're actually changing it to Moreton Bay City because we've now got such a large population. So it basically goes Brisbane, gold Coast, moreton Bay City because of the amount of people here. So at the moment I think the numbers were sitting at about 380 odd thousand in that area, in that catchment. But they're predicting by 2040, which is only 16 years away, it's going to be over 700 000. So they're talking almost doubling the numbers in. And so who's like there's?

Speaker 1: 19:51

a lot of work, correct, definitely, definitely. And if there was another stat, I'm really good at knowing things but not remembering exactly where they came from. So my wife loves it. It's a builder's thing. It is a builder's thing. We've got that much going on. But at the peak of home builder, the quantity of houses we're building then doesn't match up to the yearly statistics that the government's given out that we need to build. I think it was 46,000 homes or something a year to meet that. Yeah, and we all know what happened in HomeBuilder with the grant and yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 20:27

Nightmare.

Speaker 2: 20:28

Yeah. So, mate, how? Like I want to deep dive into a few things with you because one of the questions like with our Live, Like Build business, like we've got builders, we train, mentor builders all over Australia and New Zealand, Unbelievable community, like just incredible community of builders that is so passionate about what they do, thriving to create better businesses, better lifestyle, create a new building industry, but just safe and being able to talk about anything is amazing. Yeah, but one of the questions that I get all the I'm not sure what you call it actually, but like one of the comments I get when people are thinking about signing up is that they live in a country town. Yeah, and so you're from a country town. Definitely, Like I don't know, my plan is, or my theory is if you're good at what you do, you're passionate about what you do.

Speaker 2: 21:30

It doesn't matter where you live, and it wouldn't matter if you're only one of two builders in a in a town. You don't need to do work for everyone in that town. Yeah, you just need to do people for the work. They'll work for the people that connect with you definitely so how do you find?

Speaker 2: 21:43

working in a small town.

Speaker 1: 21:44

Well, it's reasonably small yeah, same, same, same thing, so to speak. So there's a couple of young builders coming out at the same time as me, so they've just sort of started out and I've said to them you know I can't build everything, neither can you. So let's you know, we've started having, you know regular conversations about. You know clients, or even you know what are you writing in your specifications and your contracts for special conditions and things like that about. You know, like wet driveways and things like that, who's paying for materials, and you know to make sure that they've got access to site. So it's all those little hints and tips that you know you share. But from working in a country town like there's still there is that many builders in Gympie it's not funny, but we all seem to have work and not seem to be that competing against each other. So I think the certain style of builder attracts the clientele that they want.

Speaker 2: 22:48

That's what it's got to be about, hasn't it? Definitely, everyone needs to go away from this bloody. It's all about the price. Compete Well, don't even compete.

Speaker 1: 22:58

Just do your own thing, and you'll attract clients that are attracted to you and you know I haven't always been like that. It took me a long time to realise, to run your own race, but we haven't looked back from that point in time. And yeah, realising you know, yeah, you can share secrets. You know, it's not all about secret keeping, because if we can, you know and Devin from Performance Membranes he was, you know, rising tide brings up all the ships, so it's the same thing. If we can't, you know, if we can help each other, I think it's a better thing.

Speaker 1: 23:34

I don't agree with that saying you don't agree with it.

Speaker 2: 23:37

Well, I think it's got two sides. I think, yeah, a rising tide floats all boats, yep. Yes, that's true, yep, but a rising tide also sinks anyone that's not prepared. Yes, so if you've got a group of people that are trying to do well and are rising up together, the ones that are sitting on the fence and not wanting to improve.

Speaker 1: 23:58

They're going to sink and well, I think you know, in all honesty, that's been happening anyway, yeah, is that, you know, bankrupt builders and everything along those lines, which is, you know, very unfortunate because it affects the clients and subbies and in a whole list down the line. But, yeah, exactly, you know, you need to be always, always changing and always improving.

Speaker 2: 24:17

I think, yeah to to survive in the industry, because it's always, it's always changing you know, we've got ncc and everything else that that regularly changes and trying to build a better yeah, better lifestyle and better homes yeah, it's yeah, forever changing, mate, let's just go back a little bit so we um, because we got sidetracked there a little bit, so you ended up getting an apprenticeship with the guy that you'd done labouring for three years prior or something. Yeah, and so you obviously finished your time, and then did you go build a straight away?

Speaker 1: 24:50

No, so I worked for Shane probably six or nine months, um, after the fact. And then I was, I was so eager to go out and and see how other builders did things, those those sorts of things, because we were very much, um, you know, you did one architrave at a time, you might, you marked it, you measured it, you made sure you might have fitted if it didn't, you hand planed it and skirts and everything those lines. So I was like there's got to be not not so much a better way but but a different way. And then it was, within that, going to work for a few other builders that you know we were doing subcontract carpentry labor and those sorts of things. In that you realize that you are quite happy in your skill set. Still, you know fighting for, you know how quickly and efficiently you do things. But that was a pretty big learning curve, going out working for a few other builders and then realising you know that you're happy in your trade and in yourself and to back yourself as well. So but then from there, yeah, we did so.

Speaker 1: 25:59

My wife, she finished university at the same time. I finished my apprenticeship. We did one year of real-life work and I had to work away. I built a house in Cardwell, built a house in Lowood and then also at Woomba, so Cardwell was about 22 hours hours north and it was that was where the work was, so there still wasn't a lot of work at that time. Yeah, um, so you just had to do it and I wanted to do it, um, but yeah, there we and it's good experience, isn't it?

Speaker 2: 26:30

that's definitely I think it's very healthy for I think, younger trades. They all chase the money, but they shouldn't be chasing the money. They need to chase the experience. Definitely, Hold back for six, 12, two years and use that time to experiment with a few different companies.

Speaker 1: 26:49

It's my leading hand at the moment, so he's actually leaving after Easter. But he's only a young fellow, he's 25, but he's going to an architectural builder on the coast and I've you know, I think they'll be brilliant for him. He'll. I don't know if he'll love it exactly, because he's very, he's very quick, very, very good, but it will help him in the finesse of of things. So I think it'll be a great experience and I, I want him to go, I want him to, um, almost went with him, but you know, it'd be a great, a great experience for him to to do that and see that.

Speaker 1: 27:23

So, um, but then, yeah, after that, after that year, we we needed a change, wanted to change, so we moved to london for for 13 months and I did carpentry over there and that was a massive. And I did carpentry over there and that was a massive eye-opener dealing with heritage and everything and anything and just the amount of money that people have over there. We were working on a £6 million renovation so that was 13 million Aussie back in the day and it was a 250 square metre six apartment in the middle of chelsea and they they wanted all new ceiling heights throughout, so literally gutted everything, so you could stand at the bottom and you could look up five stories all the way to the top. So new steel work, everything like that, and it's just a different style. You know we don't do that here definitely not in gimpy.

Speaker 2: 28:17

Yeah, um it's it's.

Speaker 1: 28:20

You know, so it was. It was brilliant and I think on that side of thing, you know, we developed a passion for traveling and and you know, seeing the world and and whatnot. So I'm not sure you know, I would think that's definitely benefited us to get to get where we are. And then came back we wanted to start a family. So we did that, and I've never really been one for a business plan, but we pretty much started our company, probably five years earlier than we anticipated, to be honest. So I had an apprentice we were doing carpentry subcontract work at that point in time and one from his side. You know, I realized he taught me a lot, my first apprentice. You know you can't yell at someone for something they don't know if you haven't taught them.

Speaker 2: 29:11

You know, like that is dull, I hope like I. I, I hope a couple of my chibis are listening, you know because that was, that was cootsy.

Speaker 1: 29:19

God, god love him, but it so. You know, that was my realization within in that. And then, knowing what I did in my time, to what he was doing and he's, we were doing prefab frames. So you know, one week you smash it up, then you go to safit and lock up and and fix out like there was more more to it to that. And I had one client that I couldn't shake for nine months. She, she wanted me to do her renovation and extension, um, and was happy to wait. And we, we still talk. So she still comments on on my stuff and you know, if we see each other in the street we have a chat and she, yeah, she pretty much steamrolled me into what we are now.

Speaker 2: 30:00

Yeah, and then we haven't looked back. So what sort of challenges like, did you like? What have you done to improve your business and get it to where it is now? So, like you obviously you run Rising Star last year You've done some pretty complicated jobs, yep.

Speaker 1: 30:17

That's a great question. Um, I think it's always probably just that strive to do better than what we did yesterday and if there's an issue, what can we do to solve it and not do it again or not not have it happen again. So be it, that's you know, I'm really a strong believer of communication. Now, communication is the key with trades clients. So how do you do that? Everyone so verbally, text messages, emails, those sorts of things. So it's, you know even the little things of just you know, reconfirming meetings the day before. You know, making sure that you know they're going to show up, that you're going to show up. It's just that gentle, that gentle reminder and you know. If you're going to be 10 minutes late, you let them know, because I think you know it's the honesty as well. They appreciate that, do you? Are you big?

Speaker 2: 31:12

on scheduling yes, do you schedule. Do you do on scheduling? Yes, do you do personal scheduling?

Speaker 1: 31:52

I do, yeah, so well. So that's only been something I've been trying to do this year, to be honest, and setting aside, you know, dedicated hours for, yeah, business improvement, because that's probably been the only thing lacking from you know, our building story from the last couple of years is actually working. Working, you know, on the business and tweaking the business to then, you know, work for us, um, but yeah, everyone, all my trades, know I love a good schedule and I can normally, um. I remember my electrician saying you know, if you can give me a date seven months out and you're within two days, I'm gonna be there, I'm gonna be there for you. So it's, it's those things. So scheduling is huge.

Speaker 2: 32:38

I think it's just um, oh, mate, like for years, like for six or eight years, I never ran job schedules, like I just say I'll put 10 months on the contract and then just turn up every day and ring it, ring everyone that needed to be rung and check if people were coming and try and book things in. But it was just such a shit fight like scheduling. Scheduling jobs is enormous. But yeah, yeah, I'm massive on personal scheduling now, like my wife and I have everything in our calendars like we know, yeah, doctor's appointments, kids, activities, like put all your big rocks in first personal exercise, so we don't have to check anything, like you just you get so much more done yeah, she's uh, yeah, she's the secret.

Speaker 1: 33:21

Um, you know the silent, uh, what's the word I was looking for? Yeah, the you know the silent partner in it and making sure that, yeah, everything runs, runs smoothly in in the room, so to speak, from the engine room. So from a family perspective.

Speaker 2: 33:35

So, yeah, so have you done any sort of coaching or mentoring?

Speaker 1: 33:41

No, to be honest. So I did look at that very early on, but I couldn't. The pricing I was given at that point in time from another particular mob, you know I couldn't justify it. I was given at that point in time, um from from another another particular mob, you know I couldn't justify it, to be honest, um, for being young and that was probably within as well, not realizing you know my margins and and what you need, you know, and overheads and everything along those, those lines. So that was very early on.

Speaker 1: 34:09

But then from that point I suppose on I like to be a sponge. So you know a little bit of um, you know your staff and a little bit of yeah, I think social media is a great thing from that perspective and and, like I said, if something hasn't gone right, it's what we can do, do next time. So I think every client teaches me something new, every job, yeah, that we then take forward and and move forward to to better ourselves and better their their building review at the end of every job and sort of see what, what could we have done better?

Speaker 2: 34:41

what would happen there? Where could we save some time?

Speaker 1: 34:44

money like all those definitely but it's, um, I'm not one for, yeah, like daily invoice logging and and things like that, but I definitely think you need to review your job at the end of it, because then exactly exactly what you said you can see. You know well how. How can then you move forward to price or develop another job? If you know you only had 10 days for cladding, but it took you 15 well, it's a special style of cladding, or it took you a little bit longer that you didn't realize. So you need to be aware of that to then transform onto your next, on your next job. So, um and you know I'm a little bit of obsessive with those things and and I think that's yeah, credited the ability to, like I said, we're still, we're still here, we're still going through, yeah, um, the last few years and, um, yeah, I just love it so, yeah, you're confident in all your numbers.

Speaker 2: 35:38

You know what it takes to run your business. Now I do, yeah pay yourself.

Speaker 1: 35:41

Salary yes yeah, company makes profit. Yes, so hasn't. You know, we were a sole trader early on and it's. You know. That's probably my only regret of not. You know, we're now with an account that's purely construction, you know, and they're helping us from that side as well. But I remember getting a massive tax bill one year and I said, well, what's the go? Oh, business was good, and you know, and it's from that point I was like no, there's got to be. You know, and now we do tax planning, you do. You know vast reviews and you know. You know where you're heading in forecasting and cash flow, because then that you know that makes your business less stressful.

Speaker 2: 36:24

Oh, mate, like you can't, like, I'm pleased you said you're talking to a accountant. That's construction, like that's, it's massive.

Speaker 1: 36:31

Massive. It's the you said you're talking to an accountant. That's construction like that's.

Speaker 2: 36:33

It's massive, massive difference. Popular sayings you hear in our industry goes oh my mate does this, my mate does that. Like fuck your mates. Like just go and pay money and get collaborate with good accounts and lawyers, good solicitors like, yeah, and and it's.

Speaker 1: 36:46

You know, we've had a bookkeeper now for, oh, four years or five years. So it was that realization that what I'm good at, what I make money, or how best I'm making money for the business, it's not data entry, it's not doing payroll, it's talking to clients and being on site and making sure everything's running smoothly. And then you let the people that know what they're doing do their jobs.

Speaker 2: 37:14

Yeah, you focus on your strengths and your weaknesses and ultimately, everyone in the business should be focusing on what brings the business the most value, definitely. And if you're stuffing around wasting time and being very inefficient or sitting in your office cursing because you don't know how to do something well, again I must sound like a broken record on a lot of these podcasts. Like you, we love it, though it's your own fault, like, and the reason I firmly believe that it all comes back to. People don't know their running costs, don't know their overheads, aren't paying themselves for the roles they play in the business, aren't putting company profit on top of their overheads and aren't running profitable businesses. So they try and do everything themselves because they can't afford to pay someone to do it properly.

Speaker 2: 37:59

And I think it's a trap that all businesses get into, like everyone's. Always, when we get this job, or when we earn this much money, or when we have this much in a bank account, or when we save this or when we do that, then we'll do that. But much in a bank account, or when we save this or when we do that, then we'll do that. Yeah, but reality is that never happens if you don't have a plan and a structure to get it there yeah, and so you got to do the other way.

Speaker 2: 38:18

You need to understand your overheads and put the money in the overhead to pay for that person to do the job that you don't like doing, so that you can hire that person and have the money in the business to be able to pay them and you can focus on what you want to be doing, or should be doing, tyrone, exactly Because it makes you happier.

Speaker 1: 38:33

Then, too, you know less stress, and yeah.

Speaker 2: 38:38

Tyrone. It's crazy man. I've been thinking only in the last few days. I've been driving around, I've been thinking a lot about this because, again, I get so many calls now, messages and stuff and I'm like people reach out, they want to sign up to quote ease or join, live like build, and it's it's always like well, it's three things. It's either I can't, I can't convince my missus. Yeah, number ones, I don't have enough time, but we're telling everyone struggles.

Speaker 2: 39:05

We followed very closely. Beyond that is I can't afford it and it just it drives me nuts because if you keep telling yourself that story, you're never going to have the money to progress or do any better. And like why I've been thinking about this a lot lately is it's funny because and I know I've been in this position myself a lot of the times over the years nine times out of ten the answers are right in front of us and we're getting told, or we're listening or we're hearing, or we're listening to a podcast or listen to an audible book or we're talking to a mate. Like people are giving us the answers for everything we need in life, but we think it can't be that easy, but that's all it is. We're like no, it can't be that easy, like that's, that's a con or that's or that's fake or that's not going to work, but reality is it does.

Speaker 2: 39:59

It's actually very, very easy to be very successful. I think it's just human nature. It comes back to laziness, I don't know. But it almost frustrates me now because I'm so passionate about making builders and tradies more professional and creating new industry, especially builders, and I know that what we do we can tell from our community. Our community is just absolutely killing it yeah, buzzing, but you've got to take that first step, just like you taking the first step to ring builders and do whatever you need to do to get an apprenticeship.

Speaker 1: 40:40

You've got to want to be the change yeah, you know within it.

Speaker 2: 40:42

So yeah, well, that's, that's a good like. Yeah, you've got to want to be the change. So, like, how do you like you're you're kicking girls now, a small country town, there's work for everyone. Like, do you get that? Like I understand there's guys around similar ages that you guys are connecting, but like is there older guys that are connecting as well, or do you still feel there's a bit of there's still a little bit of disconnect.

Speaker 1: 41:08

You mentioned Craig earlier, so you know we've been talking regularly now and whatnot, so it's really good from that perspective. I think there's still. You know yeah, you can't have my secrets those, those sorts of things we we've started doing, like we have regular master builder meetings, so to speak. So it's yeah, you sit um and informal ones, I should say so it's whatever members um, gimby's got 69 members, to be honest, of master builders. So there's, you know whoever can come, we just sit around the table and have a couple beers, have a couple yarns and you know, what's what's going on, or or you know what's that's awesome, hey, so what?

Speaker 2: 41:48

any? Uh, what? That's just builders or traders builders, yeah.

Speaker 1: 41:52

So, um, I'm not too sure how it's sort of come about, but I think, you know, there is that sort of feel in the industry that, yeah, we need to do something or it's gonna fall apart a little bit more.

Speaker 1: 42:02

so, yeah, which, which is great. And then it's, I'm, I'm a big push now to try and get those couple of younger builders to come through um. And then I've just been um, so been nominated to be champion of the industry for master builders for the Gympie region. So that then includes then talking to school kids, expo days, those sorts of things, going to those other meetings to try to, you know, because it is a great industry, I love it, it's a lifestyle I feel like, but I love it every day, not, let's say, six and a half out of seven days. I love it, but it's, you know, we need to get more kids in, more kids involved. But it's, you know, you've got to be the change.

Speaker 2: 42:47

So what's the half day? What's the day you don't like?

Speaker 1: 42:50

Oh, the rain lately, to be honest, but it's, yeah, I think you know there's got to be honest. But, um, it's, yeah, I think you know there's got to be that balance of good and bad in in everything, because then it makes you appreciate the good times. Yeah, um, and you don't, you know, you don't know you're at rock bottom or having a bad, bad day, till you can reflect on on that and strive to do, strive to do better. So but it's, it's, I don't think you know. I've done a lot of work on not letting the little things bother you, so I think that's yeah that's a massive, a massive thing.

Speaker 2: 43:24

So what do you think some of the challenges are that you, you face now yeah, um, at the moment it is labor, to be honest.

Speaker 1: 43:32

So we're we're struggling to find a couple more carpenters to come on board. So we had four or three, three carpenters and mature age apprentice last year, so we're down to two at the moment and then we're losing our leading hand. So I'll go back on, back on the tools for the next couple of months, reassess, try and get, yeah, a new, a new apprentice in and try to find another carpenter that matches our morals and our beliefs. So we had one start this year, but we just didn't gel, just didn't work, work together, and that was, it was a mutual, you know, a conscious decision together to to part, to, part ways and, you know, wish him all the best and and move forward.

Speaker 1: 44:14

So, um, we've been, you know, I haven't really struggled with the material side of us, material side of things. It's been, you know, because we are fairly small. Um, we do five, you know, I think in our biggest year we have done five. Our focus is to do five to ten, depending on on the size. Um, so, you know, we've then got the ability to forecast you know what we need and and whatnot. And I did, um, you know, our first home in 2020, our first house, and you know, it sort of changed overnight. You couldn't get your trusses in two weeks anymore, it was, it was 12 weeks and windows and things like that. So then that taught me that I knew I needed to be three months in front. So, coming back to scheduling, um, it was that driving, that driving factor. So, yeah, I think, yeah, struggles would just be that labor side of of things at the moment.

Speaker 2: 45:08

So yeah, what do you um? How do you go about finding new carpenters?

Speaker 1: 45:14

It's been. It's probably been that word of mouth, to be honest, and it's probably not something that's worked completely efficiently. To be honest, we've had or being approached by the builders or other carpenters my apologies, it's you know. You mentioned earlier about, you know, chippy's only, yeah, smashing up frames and things like that, and we've had, yeah, people come from from melbourne and things like that, where they just do frames and he's telling us he's you know we're slow at framing all these sorts of things, but it's about, you know, making sure that your doors are center if it works. Architraves, and you know it's the little things that I feel make the big difference at the end of the job so it's, it's that perspective, so it's one thing that I think I can definitely improve on.

Speaker 1: 46:03

So you know, at the moment I'm doing a um it's. I think it's how to communicate efficiently with employees through master builders. So I've sort of picked up that that's probably an area that I'm lacking in. So then, what, what I can then do to move forward to, to improve it. So that's, that's my big, my big thing. So always trying to learn something different so there's so many little things.

Speaker 2: 46:28

I even just what you just said about setting out to suit up trades. That is one of my pet hates. I cannot stand. Yeah, when you walk into houses and there's not full architraves, they haven't even Exactly. And again this is coming back to what I say. People aren't real carpenters. They don't even know to check what the fit-out material is going to be so they can set out doors accurately enough to make sure that you've got a full architrave in every corner.

Speaker 1: 46:55

We had a client we're on a build at the moment and the client rings me and was in a bit of a panic and was like, why are our bricks starting already and we're doing a brick base for the slab? Oh, we had friends that just built with a project mob on the coast and that didn't happen. And I was like, look, mate, you're probably going to have a few of that that's going to happen a little bit on here. And you explain to them you do a brick base, you do your window set off, set out off the bricks. So then you don't, you know, you try to minimize those cuts, um, and that's you know, what we try to carry out through all our projects is those those little things. And then you know we enjoy those building practices. Um, I enjoy doing timber ceiling battens and straightening them and things like that timber ceiling, timber ceiling?

Speaker 1: 47:45

yes, yeah, look, we do. We do use the uh, the metal ones now for for the normal areas.

Speaker 2: 47:50

But if we have a square set ceiling or a raked ceiling or something on those lines, will yeah, yeah, right, ceilings and timber and get straight ceilings and any anything a little bit out of the ordinary. But yeah, for just general flat ceilings, it's always metal.

Speaker 1: 48:04

I have made that change. That was a strong push by the boys uh to uh, yeah, to go to, to go to metal and and from that perspective, but and that's that's what I mean I try and um, you know, someone teaches me new, something new. You know, every day or every week, be it a yeah, a carpenter or a client or another sub sub trade, yeah, um, and I think you've just got to take that on board and be be open to it, which, again, I probably haven't always been open to it. I remember, yeah, yelling on site and carrying on like a pork chop, but it's yeah, you've yeah fun that I had to believe, mate, you're pretty calm, sparking it's.

Speaker 1: 48:43

Yeah, it's taken a while to get here, so, to be honest, um so how do you go about building culture?

Speaker 2: 48:49

like, what are you doing your team to, yeah, help build culture in it and make people want to hang around so that's, that's one thing as well that we're trying to change this year.

Speaker 1: 48:59

So we do like a nine-day fortnight. So I was a big believer of, you know, happy worker, happy life, so to speak, so they'll go that extra mile. So that's probably been true for 90%, 95% of all our workers. So I'm, you know, really grateful for that. But, yeah, we've instrumented a nine-day fortnight. We do, yeah, five paid days off a year for our casual workers.

Speaker 1: 49:26

So within that, you know, you've got doctor's appointments or kids' first days of school, or even we've got a carpenter at the moment, you know, he's going for a loan and and with the rain days lately, he hasn't had his full 80-hour fortnight. So he's then been using those mental health days that we call them MHD to top up his wage, because then that, you know, I feel like, well, it's a benefit to him and then it will be a benefit to me. So that that comes through. And you know, we go, we do the traditional things. We go to a pub every so often, we have a few beers and we have a few lunches, we do the golf day, those those sorts of things. But it's, it's something I think that, yeah, I can change this year and next into my business, um, you know, to make a little bit more positive.

Speaker 2: 50:15

So a lot of the time there's the small things in it. Yeah, people want to be able to know that if their kids got something at school, they can be there, and if uh, and remembering their birthdays.

Speaker 1: 50:25

Yeah, you know, um buying some mocha, or you know I'm a I'm a pretty bad coffee fiend, so it probably wouldn't be you know, a week that goes past that we have a coffee together. You know, I would take the boys coffees and you know, like they love it.

Speaker 1: 50:40

They probably just, yeah, get me talking and not have to do too much work, but it's yeah, I think it's just the little things and and being being happy within them as well, and not. You know, I hate. I hated being micromanaged as a carpenter and as an apprentice, so that's something I consciously try not to do. You know, like, as long as you know, I'm not going to tell them how to swing a door, but I'm going to tell them what I want from a gap perspective.

Speaker 2: 51:11

Do you back your doors off mate?

Speaker 1: 51:13

Always, always, always. So it's yeah. So I wouldn't tell them how to do it, but as long as it's the quickest and efficient way for them and it's still aesthetically pleasing at the end of the job, I'm happy for it. So it might not be the same way that I would do it, and that's what I mean. It's taken me a long time to realise that and be okay with that, but I trust my boys too, and I think you've got to give them that trust, so then they'll back themselves.

Speaker 2: 51:45

I think it's one of those things, isn't it? You don't teach your kids how to ride a push bike by riding it for them Exactly. I love that. I know lots of trades struggle with this, like it doesn't matter whether you're a builder or some sort of tradie, but when it's your business and it's your name on the line, and that step from like when you get to a size business where you do have to step back to spend more time in the business, like letting go of that.

Speaker 1: 52:14

Yeah, it's a big call.

Speaker 2: 52:17

Yeah, like it's something that I still reminisce about all the time now. Like I, I think my best days in my career were on the site with the tools nail bag on music, cranking bit of banner on site.

Speaker 1: 52:28

Yeah and just smashing it out like and I'm really looking forward that to that in the next.

Speaker 2: 52:32

In the next, yeah, couple of months, but yeah, we'll just have to see how the cookie in the next, yeah, couple of months, but yeah, we'll just have to see how the cookie, the cookie crumbles for everything else but like taking that step back from that and like not being there every day, yeah, and not seeing exactly what's getting done and how they're using different materials and like even like I know one of my things for a long time and I still uh, boys probably don't like it because I still ask the question now like I'm pretty anal on like size of fixing, so like, Yep, and again, this is something else that a lot of trades and carpenters just don't pay any attention to as in, like your nail diameter, sizes and.

Speaker 2: 53:12

Yeah, like making sure you, if you're using 90mm trims, make sure you've got 50s in, like. I cannot stand like if they're nailing 90mm trims on and they've got 38s, like.

Speaker 1: 53:22

I've had two new carpenters, I think, in the last year, so they've nailed off bracing ply with the wrong nails. Yeah, and I've gone. You know what the fuck, what's the go? You know what? What's the go what? You know what what's? What's the thought process here, so to speak? And oh, this is what we've always used, always done. Yeah and it's.

Speaker 2: 53:41

You know, it's those little things of knowing the code and you know, but yeah, it's, it's massive yeah, we've had a um couple of carpenters over the last couple of years where they've come onto our team and like I've like I've seen them doing something on site and I'm just like, hey, mate, what fixings you got in the gun there? Yeah, and they get all offended Like, oh, no, just like I want to check, mate, yeah, and it'll be wrong. And I was like, oh, look on our jobs. Like we would always nail that on with well, not even our jobs. Like building code says well, specification says you should be using, we need to use this. Oh, this is what I've always fucking done. Like my old boss didn't care exactly. I'm like, well, I'm not your old boss, yeah, and we do shit properly. Yeah, it'd be a mate. Like the amount of jobs that have been nailed together with the wrong size nails, yeah, like, oh, yeah, insane oh, I agree, and you know there's specifications for everything.

Speaker 1: 54:34

Yeah, so I'm big on, like we've just done, um, some james hardy sheet cladding. So you know, print it off, give it to the boys, have a read, like, you know, this is what needs to be. You know you got nail centers and you know because then, yeah, different, different houses and different, you know applications and climate zones or wind zones and yeah like, but it all comes back to you know, and I think you know the biggest thing is is them wanting that responsibility, but you know, coming down to trust as well, because then you know backing themselves, yeah, for, for that. So, um, but you know I agree with that and that's a big one. So yeah.

Speaker 2: 55:11

So, mate, where to from here, like, what's your goals for the business moving forward? Yeah.

Speaker 1: 55:16

I think it's, you know, moving forward. It would just do, you know, a few more crazy designs from a housing perspective. So we love architectural builds Not that big of a call in Gympie, but you know we like implementing, yeah, skillions and raked ceilings and things like that. So I think you I'm, I'm really happy with the size that we are now. I don't want to do 20 to 30 to 40, you know, homes a year, anything like that. So it's probably just more or less, yeah, streamline our processes. You know it'd be pretty cool to have a, you know, in-house draftsman one day in a warehouse, something like that. But then it's got to be profitable. It can't just look good, yeah, you know, from from that aspect and, um, yeah, have had more time for for the family and you know that's probably the more the main goals.

Speaker 2: 56:08

So yeah, so you're a you're a bit of a, uh, camping and adventure person. Yeah, I think it's like it's pretty standing in it to be in the building industry. I think you've got to be into Camping and adventure person.

Speaker 1: 56:15

Yeah, I think it's like it's a pretty standard thing, isn't it? It is To be in the building industry, I think you've got to be into outdoor activities.

Speaker 1: 56:20

Yeah, we were really really big on it pre-kids. So we've got a yeah, they're six and three at the moment, so we're then, you know, we're back. We've just bought a caravan last year or a little hybrid camper, so we're trying to go away, you know, as much as possible and beach and fishing and, you know, show them the good, you know the good life, so to speak, and be outside and, yeah, be with nature. It's great. So you know, we grew up, you know, camping at Inskip Point for four or five weeks a year, like just being absolute ferals, you know.

Speaker 1: 56:54

So that's, that's something that you know we want to do again.

Speaker 2: 56:57

Well, that's good, isn't it?

Speaker 1: 56:58

It's that quality time Outdoors.

Speaker 2: 56:59

Yeah, do you find like do you use any of that sort of messaging in your marketing? Like to connect with other young families?

Speaker 1: 57:08

Not no, I don't actually. So that's probably a good aspect to go down. It's probably a good aspect to go down In my. I think my main focus, or what I try to convey to clients, is clear-cut communication and working with them to achieve their goals. So we do, you know we've developed a little bit of our own process where you know we get on early, we do soil testing. You know everything along those lines that can you know we get on early, we do soil testing. You know everything along those lines that can you know change or affect or how we should build the house if it's. You know, council requirements. You know we check all those things.

Speaker 1: 57:45

So then when we go to build, it's a streamlined effect and and do and to do a conscious budget management of that whole process. So, yeah, we got sick of you know clients coming in and we've had two builders quote 500 and 505, but our budget's 450, can you? You know this was a couple of years ago, can, can you do 450? And I said, well, look, no, if two guys have quoted it like it's a 500 000 house, you need to change your plans. So then it's that you know. And then she's like, well, it's going to cost me x amount of need to change your plans. So then it's that, you know. And then she's like well, it's going to cost me x amount of money to change my plans. We've got energy efficiency, we've got all the other reports, engineering, so it's that then flip side, so it's more of that collaboration work that we strive on with with the client, um, and then also do you charge for that I do yeah, so and it's you know very early on, probably didn't cover costs, those sorts of things.

Speaker 1: 58:40

But I quickly learned you know, if the client doesn't see benefit in it, then they're not the client for us. Yeah, um, and you know even now to the point of you know, if I've got clients that want to meet after hours, it doesn't happen to be honest. Like I've got clients that want to meet after hours, it doesn't happen to be honest. Like I've got a young family and you know my wife would have been a single mum the first two years of our building business and I want to change that.

Speaker 1: 59:06

You've got to set expectations Correct and you know, 95% of the time they're fine with that and they agree with that. So they're more than happy to accommodate.

Speaker 2: 59:15

So it's a two-way street, yeah you've got to set clear expectations and then stick to them. For the entire build.

Speaker 1: 59:22

It's developing that relationship then too. So you know they own the plans. At the end of our process they can go out and get other quotes or tenders. But we've got a pretty high success rate with what we do, because then from that we're making sure that the building is efficient to build. So who's doing the plans? Our draftsman, all the draftsmen, the local draftsmen that we use?

Speaker 2: 59:51

Are they engaged directly with him?

Speaker 1: 59:54

Through me, so with professional indemnity and everything along those lines. So yeah, it's that collaboration effort so to speak.

Speaker 2: 1:00:03

I've talked to you a bit more off air about it, mate You're leaving yourself open for some possible big problems there, sure thing happy to discuss. Yeah, no, any other consultant should never be engaged or paid for through you, like it's just, it's a can of worms. You just never know what could happen from that definitely no more than happy to chat, mate.

Speaker 1: 1:00:24

It's all about learning and, um yeah, striving to be be better than yesterday yeah, no, that's awesome, mate.

Speaker 2: 1:00:30

I hope you keep kicking goals and look. I hope, um, people that are listening have taken a lot out of today to look, because you just prove it doesn't matter where you are in the world, but you're in a small country town. You still manage to get into business, grow a business, um, and continue to be successful. So, um, yeah, I think for me there's no excuses.

Speaker 2: 1:00:51

I don't know what you think, but, like life, is what you make it so if you keep telling yourself yourself you're in a small country town, you can't compete, you're never going to get enough jobs, all that sort of stuff you're holding yourself back. Exactly Just before we wrap it up, what advice would you give to some young tradies that are maybe going through what you went through, where they can't get a job or apprenticeship? What's some?

Speaker 1: 1:01:11

advice yeah, just don't give up, so to speak. You've got to. You know, if you want something that bad, just just strive for it, because you know you, you blink and you know, I don't know how many years later, but you know, you got two kids, a family and a dog and a building business.

Speaker 2: 1:01:28

So, um, yeah, it's I think that's the title for this podcast two kids, a family and a dog and a building business.

Speaker 1: 1:01:38

So, yeah, no, it just wouldn't. Yeah and be you know, if you're going to do something, do it properly. Yeah, and just keep being persistent no, mate, really appreciate your time.

Speaker 2: 1:01:48

I know it's been a long drive down here today, but I think you've offered a lot of value and I think continuing to this podcast is all about just telling people stories, and by telling stories you're going to help influence other people, so definitely if we can get a couple more people into the industry, it's only a good thing yeah, so, mate, for anyone that wants to reach out to you, mate, possibly about a job in gimpy or a job. How do they reach you?

Speaker 1: 1:02:11

yeah, no. So we've got um, yeah, on our, our website there's a messaging form base, so just wwwalternativeconstructionprojectscomau. You can send me an email. It's build at alternativeconstructionprojectscomau, so you really need to want to send me an email if you type that one in. But yeah, social, so Instagram, facebook, yeah, we try to be be big on on those aspects and yeah, it's um, yeah, or just give me a call.

Speaker 2: 1:02:43

So, yeah, awesome. Well, mate, thanks very much for taking the time out to jump on. Look, as always. If you like the podcast, make sure you subscribe, uh, like, share, comment, all those types of things, because, uh, yeah, look, this podcast can only help so many people. We want to help the world, so, uh, help us get it out there by subscribing, commenting, liking and all those types of things. And look, um, if you want to be on the podcast, reach out to us. We'd love to. Uh, if you're a building designer, architect, builder, tradie or just someone that wants to get on and tell their story, um, we'd actually love to have more clients on. I want to have discussions with clients about their experience when building and renovating. So, if you are that person or you know someone, then make sure you reach out to us. But we'll see you on the next one. Are?

Speaker 1: 1:03:26

you ready to build?

Speaker 2: 1:03:27

smarter, live better and enjoy life.

Speaker 1: 1:03:29

Then head over to livelikebuildcom. Forward slash elevate to get started.

Speaker 2: 1:03:43

Everything discussed during the Level Up podcast with me, dwayne Pearce, is based solely on my own personal experiences and those experiences of my guests. The information, opinions and recommendations presented in this podcast are for general information only, and any reliance on the information provided in this podcast is done at your own risk. We recommend that you obtain your own professional advice in respect to the topics discussed during this podcast.