The Good Builder: Sharing Great Stories About the Building Industry.

GET YOUR TICKETS TO THE LEVEL UP EXPERIENCE HERE - https://duaynepearce.com/events/ 

#137 Australia falls significantly behind in building healthier homes, with moisture management being a critical factor that most builders aren't addressing properly. We're joined by Jesse and Dan from Pro Clima Australia to explore how vapour-permeable weather barriers create healthier, more durable buildings compared to traditional foil sarking that traps moisture and creates perfect conditions for mould growth.

check out Pro Clima here...

proclima.com.au

Check out Duayne's other projects here...

Live Life Build
livelifebuild.com

D Pearce Constructions
dpearceconstructions.com.au

QuoteEaze
quoteeaze.com/Free-Offer.html

Transcript

Duayne: 0:45

Like hats off to you for reaching out, mate, and just constantly putting good stuff out there.

Peter: 0:50

It should be a much more revered profession. It really should. I feel for builders these days.

Duayne: 0:55

I'm going down that path because I sort of like stuff it like if these, if all the associations, industry bodies, government aren't going to listen, like let's just do it.

Peter: 1:03

There's a lot of experienced builders out there like let's get them in front of cameras, let's get them talking, let's share their knowledge with the industry.

Duayne: 1:20

G'day guys. Welcome back to another episode of Level Up. We are back for another cracking episode today. It's actually been a big day. This is our third podcast for today and our third cracking guest. So something a bit different today. Not a tradie, not a builder, but a media company. How are you, mate?

Peter: 1:34

Yeah, good, dwayne, I'm very, very thankful to be here in the shed, yeah, no, I love it.

Duayne: 1:39

So for those of you that well, I should have introduced you first, but today we've got Pete from the Good Builder. That's it, mate, and I think it's awesome. We hardly know know each other, but we are getting on quite well. Pete reached out to me was it before chris? And ask chris a few months ago, yeah, a few months ago, um, and told me what he was doing. And yeah, just, we had a chat and since then we've we've caught up a few times. We've had multiple conversations on the phone. Uh, you've published a few articles with my opinions in them. But I wanted to get Pete on today because the guys are going to be at my Level Up Experience event and they're going to have a little I guess what do you call it studio set up and be going for it. So we'll get into more about what they're about. But before we do that, if you haven't seen yet yet, you must be hiding under a rock, because we have the greatest event coming up in the building industry the level up experience.

Duayne: 2:36

It's on the 30th of may, friday, the 30th of may. It's here in brisbane. Doesn't matter where you are across australia, new zealand, anywhere, you must get to this event. If you're in the construction industry, this is a day where you can put the tools to the side. You can sit down, take a step back and come to something that is going to excel you to the next level. We're going to be talking about all things business development, personal development. We've got the world's number one building science expert, matt Reisinger, coming out from the States first time ever. We also have Paula Baker-Laporte, who has been the world's leading healthy home expert for the last 30 to 40 years, plus a whole other host of world-class guest speakers. And then, on top of that, an incredible trade show over 60 of Australia's biggest and best suppliers coming along.

Duayne: 3:23

But I'm going all out. I'm making this event all about what builders and tradies need. So it's not just going to be tools and materials. We've got full drive equipment companies coming along. We've got full drive canopy companies coming along, full drive accessory companies coming. We've got machinery excavators, anything that you can think of that you possibly need, not only in your business, but to go fishing on the weekends, to enjoy your life once you start running a great business. So make sure you lock in friday, the 30th of may, to come to the level up experience, and not only will you get to see all that incredible stuff, you'll also get the opportunity to win over 50 000 worth of lucky door prizes. And talk to these guys I can't wait, mate.

Peter: 4:06

What an event. Good on you for, yeah, going this big for your first event.

Duayne: 4:10

Well, mate, it's make or break. I've put it all on the line. It's costing us a bucket load of money to do this. And look a massive shout out to Brett's Hardware, brett's Trade, for getting behind me as well. If it wasn't for them, this event wouldn't be possible. They're supplying the venue and they've got a lot of contacts with the trades and things. But, um, this industry has to change and it's why I really love what you guys are doing. So, pete, like the good builder, it's uh, if you haven't heard of it, it's, it's, it's everywhere. It's on linkedin, it's on instagram, you have a website, yeah, um, yeah, and you're actually spreading good media, good publicity, yeah, the good stories, none of this shit about insolvencies and all the rubbish that you hear about constantly. So it's a big move, mate, to do that.

Peter: 5:04

It is, it has been and it came out of, I think the last few years the industry has just been battling with its reputation, particularly in the public eye. People just stopped wanting to build because they were too afraid of the process. And I had a business which was helping people build homes and people were just saying, look, we're too scared to do this. Builders are going bankrupt left, right and centre. But then you come to 2024. Know, 2024, conditions have stabilized people.

Peter: 5:33

You know we can build good homes and good time frames and builders aren't. Who are managing their business right, they're not going, you know they're not going to go broke. So we said there's a lot of good builders out there, but no one's focusing on them. No one's talking about the good builders. So let's, let's start a business that does that. And, uh, we saw a bit of a gap in the industry and in that there's not a media platform that focuses on the home building industry. There's some for development, there's some for real estate, but nothing for home builders yeah and so we thought, hey, let's, let's give this a go.

Duayne: 6:01

And yeah, so like to give everybody a bit of background. You've got a business partner yes, yeah. So aaron, aaron and myself kicked it off, yeah so these guys have basically put everything on the line to get out of that. Like you sold your old businesses, yes, yeah, and basically jumped in the deep end. Like there's a lot of passion there, there's a lot of risk, yeah, um. But man, you're going hard and so far from what I've seen, like what you're putting out there is quality. Oh, thanks, mate.

Peter: 6:33

Yeah, and it's all stuff that needs to be talked about yeah, oh, it's um, like the whole point of it is to interview. We're not good builders, I'm not a builder. Yeah, you don't want the home that I would build, but it's bringing and they're honest yeah, and that's the last thing you want to be, you know.

Peter: 6:51

But there's a lot of good builders out there and that's why I've loved your content and followed you for quite a long time. And there's a lot of experienced builders out there like let's get them in front of cameras, let's get them talking, let's share their knowledge with the industry, uh and and hopefully by focusing on those kind of guys and raising the bar, you know, across the board and and women and there's a lot of great women out there too that we've been profiling and um, yeah, mate, so it's pretty exciting. We're really enjoying it. It's a fun business. It's like we've got a good purpose behind it. Financially, it's going to take some time, I think, to make good money, but that's that's another thing, but that's all right let's.

Duayne: 7:26

I want to go back a bit before we go further. What's your background? Because I know one of them which you'll get to, and I find it hard to go from that one to where you are now.

Peter: 7:36

Yeah, sure, mate. So I'm a lawyer by trade, dwayne, mate, and, very briefly, I finished my qualifications. Then I looked at the career ahead of me and just thought, no, I don't think this is for me. I didn't love the work and I'm to be honest, lawyers have to be very organized and I'm not that organized and uh, but, mate, so I, uh, I quit.

Peter: 7:57

So why did you go into that to start with? Like, just, I'm not sure. To be honest, I love to write, I love, um, communicating, but I just my next door neighbor owned a law firm and I remember going out in the grass when I was in about grade 11. I was like, what should I do with my life, glenn? And he was like become a lawyer, mate, and I loved the intellectual side of law.

Peter: 8:20

But you go into law thinking you're going to save the world and it's justice and it's rights, and you realize that it's and I've seen it more and more in business Lawyers will always win, but you're not. I don't feel in what we were doing. We're adding a whole lot to society and I love lawyers, like there's a lot of great lawyers out there and if you love it, you love it. But yeah, I didn't see the purpose behind it for what we were doing, so I quit that job. I went to Indonesia for a month, grew a beard, bought a big book on finance, on security analysis or something, and was like, all right, I'm going to move to Sydney and become a stockbroker or jump into the finance game. And then I came back from Indo, I went to the Malulaba Surf Club and it was a Friday night and there was a few beers in. And then I ran into Greg Greg Gardner, who founded GJ Gardner Hose, and I think he was a few beers in too.

Peter: 9:13

He was like oh, what are you doing with yourself? I went to school with his son. What are you doing with yourself these days? I was like, oh, I'm just about to go to Sydney and try my luck at investment banking or something, and he goes. I want you to come talk to my CEO. I was like what do you mean? He's like we need a general manager. I was like Greg, I don't know anything about construction. He's like no, no, no, we need someone to come shake things up a little bit and provide this and that. Anyway, next thing, that was Friday. On the Monday, I met with the CEO and we did another three or four interviews with the management team. We did another three or four interviews with the management team.

Duayne: 9:53

And next, thing, I know I was starting as a general manager for GJ Gardner Homes across Australia and New.

Peter: 9:56

Zealand. I was only 24. Holy shit.

Peter: 9:59

So yeah and yeah, so that was, it was wild. He took a massive punt on me and I was very, very green and look, the first. I remember sitting down across from one of the builders, uh, and within the first week he just looked me in the eye and said how many homes have you built? It's just like, oh. And my old man had electrical contracting business and I'll lean on that a bit because I did do a quick, you know month or two of an apprenticeship with him, which which was, you know, scraping concrete off wheelbarrows, but yeah, it was.

Peter: 10:34

I just kept my mouth shut for about three months and just started to learn the industry. Gj Garden is a franchise network and there was 50 offices in Australia at that time and there was a lot of low-hanging fruit because it was like a McDonald's but a different color in each state, and I hope they don't mind me saying this, they probably do, but you know like the brand was. It was always being red, but another state was moving to like an orange, and then there was just some real basic things which I had to get in and sort out, uh, and then after that I just learned what the good people were doing and then tried to roll that out across the group more broadly. And then, yes, I was there for six years.

Duayne: 11:12

That sort of shit doesn't just happen by a fluke. Like you, obviously you've either got the gift of the gab or uh, or you, you know your shit like that, that's uh, that's a big yeah company. Yeah, they're not going to take the risk on just anyone. So you're probably underestimating yourself a bit there, I think.

Peter: 11:32

It was objectively, no matter who I am, it was a massive risk for them to take, but I feel like I learned the respect of the key people over time and then we started to have some really good success and I think we're doing about 1,000 builds a year across Australia. When I started, when we finished finished, we were up to two thousand and we had another about almost three thousand sales in the books and the market had done well in that time as well. I timed the market cycle really well, but. But there was a lot that I learned then about what makes a good builder, how to do it right and and that in that sort of volume building space, but yeah, yeah, and also a few things about the industry, which was, you know, kind of a bit of a shock as well, and a lot of it is, at that level, a sales and marketing game and it's a numbers game you know, but yeah, so yeah, it's good mate, that's a wild start.

Duayne: 12:28

Yeah, like a uni lawyer indo running a thousand house business.

Peter: 12:34

It was. And we had our first kid a few years into that. And then it got tricky because I was traveling almost every week, every second week, around the country to the different franchises. And then we had our second kid after my sixth year and my wife just said to me look, I love, love you, but I don't think we're gonna last if you keep this up. And but she was great, she's like I'll support you, whatever. But this is really straining. And I was like, yeah, no, it's time to start my own thing. So I kind of thought, look, I'll take what I've learned here and then start a business locally. And so, yeah, started, hello home property.

Peter: 13:15

After that, um, I mean, that was like a buyer builder's advocacy for first home buyers, because there was a lot of support for investment, people building investment properties out there. Yeah, um, but I was like the first home buyers are the ones that need it. You know they come in so so green, so clueless as to even what sort of block of land they should be looking for, because there's so many grants. It's like if you're a first-time buyer, you get your first-time owner fifteen thousand dollars. You get all this money thrown at you from the government. So they think, all right, we'll go and build new. But they don't have the first clue how to do it right, and they quite often get taken advantage of. And so we came in and we'd help them understand their finance and then say, all right, you can, you've got a seven hundred thousand dollar budget. Let's have a look at what you can buy, so you can buy land here, here and here. And then we'd go and help them find the block and we're like, don't, they'd find something in a great area, but it's just, you know, down the side of a cliff. Okay, they go, look at, this is cheap, we'll just grab this one. Yep, it'll cost you a million plus to build on it. And so we'd advise them around that. And then we'd sit with them and try and sign up a house plan. And then we got a.

Peter: 14:19

We were working with a custom home builder and we learned to use their architectural AutoCAD software, and so we'd sit with the clients and try and design the homes with them, which was a terrible idea, because it's You're not a designer. Yeah, well, they did, but they'd just come up with the most stupid ideas and we wouldn't stop anything Like not stupid, but you know they're just their dream home and they're sketching it away. We'd do it up, we'd try and get the orientation right, get all the basics right, and then we'd send it off to a draftee and then we'd go and talk to builders and work with builders to see it through to completion and handover. Yeah, um, so we did that and then, probably by 2020, I had there's only two of us and then covid hit and then, uh, the industry sort of shut down, as you all know, and it was a pretty scary time.

Peter: 15:09

Um phone stopped ringing. I think I had about 10 people call up cancel contracts and I said to tim it was my first time. I said, mate, this might be us, you know we might be out. And then we heard from the government that they're going to do a big stimulus package and a few weeks later they announced they were going to do the home builder grant, which was,000 for anyone to build a new home, and we got 50 leads overnight. Yeah, that's just the two of us. And then, within a year, we had signed off, we had about 80 contracts, we had a team of eight and then, yeah, 2021, we signed 120 contracts and it was just madness.

Peter: 15:49

So you were basically just a, you just guided them through the process, guided them through the process and very quickly you could see we started looking at a lot of the bigger builders to partner with and just the process wasn't there. So we'd find good local builders. I mean, half the challenge, I think, if you're building a home, is just finding a builder you can trust. And once you find them, they'll take you through the process and they should have all their process and it's fine. So a lot of our thing was done due diligence with builders. We met with dozens and dozens of builders and said, all right, well, how do you deal with this, this, this, and and I was learning a lot as well because I'd come from the general manager at a very high level, you know, sitting in the pearly tower or whatever it is you know like, but I wasn't on the ground doing it, yeah, and so I was learning a lot as well. But we eventually partnered with some great builders, uh, and we just say like here's the plans, and then you get an idea of what they can build it for, take them through the contracting process and just if things weren't right, we'd negotiate. And then, uh, yeah, just hold the hand.

Peter: 16:53

Our biggest thing was communication. So every single week. I said without fail doesn't matter what happens, you call the client every week and in the volume building space it wasn't super common. You know the supervisors get in, smash them out and they're just oh, we'll update them when we've got up to a new stage. Yeah and we'll no. No, so we would do all the communication with the client. We'd we? They wouldn't even really talk to the builder, so we try and take the stress away from them. If something popped up on site, we try and deal with it separately. Um, and then, yeah, just take them all the way through until handover, and then so you're like an agent.

Duayne: 17:24

So on on the building contract, were you? You were the agent that the builder liaised with.

Peter: 17:28

Were you well, effectively, yeah, yeah, yeah, um, we were, yeah, we were kind of the client, yeah, that way, and so I think, probably, like many, we just took on more than we could chew in 2021. I mean, and the builder that we had we had 80 contracts with one builder and a really good builder, but he went from 150 homes the year before to 450 homes. Yeah, that's a big jump and it's just it was too much, too much for his team. We were waiting, you know, from waiting two weeks for a set of drafted plans, it was 16 weeks just to get a contract in place. It was taking, yeah, like six months and then we would get to site and slabs. It would be a 12-week wait. Everything was just blowing out in that time and we were on the phones just keeping the clients every week updated. So, yeah, mate, it was pretty crazy. Sorry, I'm talking a lot.

Duayne: 18:23

No, mate, it's good Like we're telling your story, because people need to get to know you a bit so they get the backstory of it. So how did you go from there to where you are now?

Peter: 18:31

Yeah. So we saw that. We saw everyone in. We got everyone in through that time. The biggest challenge was land would take a long time to get to site and then, once it got there, the builder couldn't build for that price because they'd signed a fixed price contract. So we had to call about 80 customers and say, hey, I know your finance is approved and you're ready to go, but the builders just told us they won't build it. They want another 50 grand to make it sustainable. And so we did that. But for the whole team, it was just every day was tears, every day was emotion, uh, and it burned us all out, to be honest. So I think 2022 was one of the hardest years kovat was just like the government did.

Duayne: 19:09

What the government does made it. It made rash decisions without investigating everything and it put like, yes, that grant was good and it stimulated everything and it got a lot. Like the industry, it was too much, got through it, but it was too much. It burned a lot of people out.

Peter: 19:24

It made a lot of businesses go bankrupt yeah, oh, it completely overstimulated because interest rates are already very low and land was really cheap, it didn't need much of a push. You know, yeah, yeah, and to give people 25 grand plus the first time buyers were getting another 15, so they were getting $40,000. And for a lot of them they'd come in with five grand and we could get them a home. Yeah, but anyway, yeah. So it just cooked the industry and I felt for all the builders.

Peter: 19:50

We accepted all the price increases, didn't push back because they had to survive, they because they had to survive, they all had to survive. But thankfully everyone was making enough money on their overall purchase that people could make it work and got. Everyone in the team was cooked. I was pretty cooked and I just thought, look, this is a good business model. It was very rewarding once you hand over the homes. But I don't want to be doing this forever, and so we scaled it down a little bit and then I found someone to sell it to which was last year, and now you've put it all on the line.

Duayne: 20:22

mate, to start the good builder.

Peter: 20:24

That's right, mate. Yeah, so my business partner, aaron he was when I was at GJ Gardner. He came on board as a national marketing manager and so him and I ran some great campaigns together and then he left to start his own marketing agency focused on the construction industry, and so I work with a lot of builders around the place and a lot of suppliers, uh, but he was a bit sick of agency life as well, and so he um, he wrapped up his business and, yeah, this time probably literally three and a half, four months ago we really launched into these to the good builder yeah, so what?

Duayne: 20:58

what is the goal of the good builder? Like, besides just being able to promote um? Like from what I've seen so far? Like you promote a lot of government incentives. You, you're definitely promoting good people in the industry. Like I see you must be going through my podcast list because I see all these guests coming out that we've had on. So that's, that's good. I look up to that. The um, I take it as a compliment.

Duayne: 22:19

But um you've got some really good people coming on there, and I just think that the industry needs more of it like that's. That's a big reason why we do this podcast. Like you, we have to share stories of people that are doing the right thing in the industry yeah, yeah, 100%, and so we've we've got a lot more to come out.

Peter: 22:36

We've probably got another six interviews with builders that we've done um over the past few weeks to come out, which would be great, and just want to do more of that.

Peter: 22:44

There's four pieces to it, so we're going to have the site, um, and then we've got the podcast. So we've just we've launched that and um and that'll be the same thing just interviewing builders, uh. And then events. So with our events, we just just builders, or tradies, builders, suppliers, um, anyone who's, yeah, doing a good job in the industry, and tradies, yeah, it's um, absolutely so, but probably more focused towards builders, yeah, um. And then events yeah, so events are coming up and for events like we just there's a lot of events out there and I love, I love what you're doing, dwayne, with the upcoming one mate, but events like that, where it's builders talking to builders and a lot of the events from the industry organizations and all that, which are great, uh, and definitely have their place, but it's people just talking to you how to build us, just telling them this is what's what, this is what's new, this is how you should run your business, but a lot of them aren't actually builders, you know, and aren't in the trenches.

Duayne: 23:42

I don't see education in our industry. No, like you go to industry events with associations and even industry bodies and it's, as you just sort of said, like it's not educational. It's them just you just sort of said like it's not educational, it's them just telling you, yeah, like this is what we expect, this is what we're trying to do, yeah, and I just think it's all broken and backwards and it needs to be done differently. Like you see the associations banging all the time how they're trying to help this and help that and they're working with the government to stop this, but they don't, like there's not enough conversation with the people that are actually in it?

Peter: 24:24

oh exactly. Well, that's the thing, and I don't know if you've seen this there's a national construction industry forum which has just released a blueprint blueprint for the construction industry and it's meant to solve all the issues and it's a 20 page document with what the future of the industry looks like. Not one person on that forum is a builder or owns a building company or runs a building company, so that's just like how will that ever solve our problems?

Peter: 24:50

it's never going to solve the problems. It's so detached from reality and that's that's where yeah, like that's where we're looking to. All right, let's try and get builders talking to builders, have forums where we can all talk about the issues, and then so how do you?

Duayne: 25:02

I haven't seen that. How do people in the industry actually get a hold of that document?

Peter: 25:08

If you search it, yeah, the National Construction Industry Forum Blueprint it's. Yeah, you'll see it there.

Duayne: 25:18

So that's a blueprint for our industry.

Peter: 25:19

Why is not every builder and tradie and architect designer like made aware of it. It's actually really interesting. I mean, the hia and mba presidents are on it, but they're the only ones that are related to home building, uh, but they're not even talking about it. So I don't think anyone, to be honest, is too proud about it. It's not, yeah.

Duayne: 25:36

Someone's probably spent millions of dollars. Oh, absolutely yeah.

Peter: 25:39

Yeah, I mean it's. Half of the forum are union bosses, so a lot of it is more around like labor rights.

Duayne: 25:49

It's all just about lining someone's pockets, yeah.

Peter: 25:54

It adds a lot more regulation and red tape. I've read a quick read through it. I'm like this is just going to make it more difficult Talking to builders now and we're talking to builders every day, just like you, mate. But compliance is a major issue. Just keeping up with all the compliance I feel for builders these days.

Duayne: 26:10

Well, a builder, look, we run a good business. But I'll put my hand up, we don't comply with everything. Like, if we, like they whinge about the cost of housing. And reality was, if we were to build a job, start to finish and comply with every single requirement, like I don't know, without exaggerating, it would add at least probably 20 to 40% to our jobs. Really, yeah, well, you're not even supposed to have a concrete truck on site without traffic control. You're not supposed to have a concrete pump on site without traffic controller. Every day you get traffic control to a site. That's eighteen hundred two and a half thousand dollars.

Duayne: 26:46

Yeah, then it's not only that. Then you, if you have traffic control, you're supposed to have a traffic permit. Then you've got to apply to council. So then there's going to be all these times on jobs where there's nothing, nothing happening because you're waiting for permits. Yeah, because, like at the moment with this rain, like what, what would happen if I had three jobs with concrete pours and then they all got pushed for the rain? Then I've got to reapply for all those permits and I've got to rebook all my traffic control. Yeah, yeah, but then that's just one example. Like, then you've got all the scaffolding requirements and the guard rails and like, and then all the signing into sites, signing out of sites. So if seriously, if a builder was to run a site to to these legislations, it would add tens of thousands of dollars, if not hundreds of thousands of dollars it's ballistic.

Peter: 27:33

You know I was thinking about it. You know, coming from a lawyer's perspective. A lawyer specializes in one area and you've just got to know that area. Well, a builder has to be across so many different elements of building, every element of building a home, and how it is done well, and then the compliance with all the manufacturer warranties, and then you've got all the government regulation and compliance. It's just, it's outrageous.

Duayne: 27:53

It's unbelievable. And then people try and question what we make.

Peter: 27:56

Yeah, I know it should be a much more revered profession. It really should. You know. And um, and that's something we want to like, I'd love to run a campaign in schools and just really raise the reputation and status of what a trade career is and and what being a builder is. And yeah, either or you know we've um, we tried that.

Duayne: 28:16

Like we reached out, we've we've done a um. Like shane, I've been and uh, we've been to a couple of trade colleges. We, we went to a state school locally. Like I like if anyone's listening in southeast queensland, like that, that's something that I'm really passionate about. Like I will, I will give up my time and go and visit um. I really want to get in front of year 10 students. Yeah, I think if we can get in front of year 10 students. Yeah, I think if we can get in front of year well, even nine, year nine and 10 students, and we can, because I always talk about it all the time. Like I definitely believe.

Duayne: 28:46

So for me, I grew up around tradies and a lot of my family and friends and things and I just thought a tradie was throwing a nail bag on and going to site, like I. I didn't understand that to be a tradie you've got to run a business, and to run a business, you, you need to have some sort of english skills, math skills, computer skills, like man, like it takes me four hours to type an email, it takes my wife fucking two seconds, um, so that's, I want to go. I want to get in front of kids at years nine or ten and say to them look, be a tradie, it's awesome, but don't be like me. Like, put the time into. Like, if you want to be a tradie, that's awesome, you don't need geography and all that other shit, but you do need to do well in this, this and this.

Duayne: 29:34

Yeah, and I don't know if I I think I would have paid more attention and done better if I had had someone, because I think, like everything, my big thing in life now is, if you want to achieve something, you need to look up someone that's done it. And if I feel, for me, if I had a successful builder in in a room telling me, hey, if you want to be a builder, you need to do this, you need to do that, you need to do that, I honestly believe I would have put more effort in yeah, sure, yeah, you would be more motivated and seen a pathway.

Duayne: 30:04

Yeah, because I just and and look. The other thing is that I, where I really think the world falls over is like school schooling, I believe. My personal opinion is it's got an agenda. Um, like we should be taught. Like business should be a subject that is compulsory. Like it shouldn't be something you have to select. Like it should be compulsory and you should learn about taxes, you should learn about investing, you should learn about gst. Like oh, like yeah, because as a business owner, this is all you deal with on a day-to-dayday basis and at some point most people have an abn and do something.

Peter: 30:41

You know like it's, it's yeah, yeah, like cash flow bloody profit margins markup like it's.

Duayne: 30:47

There's just why we aren't taught about it blows my mind and it's.

Peter: 30:52

It's kind of sad that the own pretty much the best education and the only education in a lot of these topics for builders now is through people like yourself and all these organizations that are popping up trying to educate builders. Yeah, but because it's not there, you know, in the system well, mate, I don't know.

Duayne: 31:10

To be honest, I'm not not sure what exactly is the requirements now, but, like for me, once I've done my, finished all my builders licensing, passed everything, got all my certificates, um, proved all my experience, it was literally going to a three-day business course which taught you jack shit and I got my license, like, and then you can literally go out the next day, sign a million dollar contract and go broke. Yeah, yeah, like it's insane, but like hats off to you for reaching out mate and getting the just constantly putting good stuff out there.

Peter: 31:45

Yeah, that's the aim and it's hard, I mean there's also there are builders that aren't great out there, you know, and the tempting thing is to all right, should we poor performers is what not to do. And you know, we've decided against it because you know, and there is some frustrating things, you know, particularly around you know, the sustainability side and builders everyone claiming certain things which is just plainly not true, and I saw a lot of it in my previous business. But no, we want to be positive, we want to, you know, just, let's focus on the good builders, show what they're doing and hopefully the industry can raise the bar a little bit that way and yeah, yeah, and get you know messages like the ones that you're putting out and out there further and yeah so what do you need, mate, to um to make the good builder like I assume the good builder you want to spread australia wide.

Duayne: 32:34

Yeah, that's not just for queensland.

Peter: 32:36

Yeah, that's right. Yeah, so we're heading down to sydney next month and melbourne to start building networks and trying to start pushing out there. I don't know what an interest. So we're just building a team. We need a good team, really. Um, so if there's anyone out there who wants to write about construction and talk about it and you know can do that, reach out, we'd love to. And sponsorship, yeah, sponsorship. So we're talking to suppliers and suppliers have said hey, if you can build this and get an audience, we'll get behind you. So we're still waiting for them, but they'll be coming, we're sure. Yeah, mate.

Duayne: 33:14

Well, it's not like oh mate, I know where you're at because I put a downer on it like we've been doing this podcast for two and a half years and it's only just starting to make money. It's a long road and you've got to put a lot on the line, but I don't know.

Peter: 33:30

I think when you believe in something and you push hard, it definitely pays off in the end now we can see a path for it to work out financially, because it's got to support us and our wives are certainly interested in seeing us getting paid a salary soon.

Peter: 33:45

But no, aaron and I are having the most fun and enjoying ourselves more than we ever have, really and learning a lot, and there's just some great people in this industry, so it's been great just interviewing them and bringing their stories out and, yeah, I think it's just how can we it's what issues do we latch onto and then make a part of trying to make a bit of change as well at the same time, yeah, and also getting. What I've seen and as you talk about as well, is there's a big divide in the industry and we've got the volume space divide in the industry and we've got the volume space, the project home builders, which is an area I know really well, uh, but then we've got, you know, I guess, builders who are smaller custom, you know, architectural homes and yeah, um, you know so it's and they're they're kind of looking for different things, it's got to be separated, mate.

Duayne: 34:33

Yeah, absolutely 100. It's got to be separated, like we. And again, it ties back to all the legislation stuff we've mentioned before. Like you can't expect, but the, the government expects that small operators can have, can run by the same legislation as what the big guys do, and it, just it, just it. Well, it doesn't need to happen and it can't happen. And, like I've touched on before, like if seriously, like if they think the cost of housing is expensive, now, like man, if they, if they really put their foot down and push things, like it will go through the roof.

Peter: 35:06

Yeah.

Duayne: 35:07

Cause there's just so much like. If we were to do every single thing we're supposed to, I can tell you right now we would probably have to employ at least another uh, definitely a dedicated administration person to deal with it all, and and possibly another construction manager or someone that actually understood it so they could work with the admin person to make sure that everything on site was correct.

Duayne: 35:31

Yeah, it's wild, so you're adding another two hundred thousand dollars a year to like my business salaries. Yeah, yeah, um, yeah. And then that doesn't even take into account all the additional shit that's actually required on site, like all the permits, all the hiring, all the staff, like it's insane.

Peter: 35:51

But yeah, it's yeah, there's no, there's no answers, Like one thing that we've. You know, the current government is actually the Queensland government has been listening to a lot of things, and I'm talking to people in the industry who are on these advisory boards with the government and they're actually listening, which I think there will be a bit of change coming up. Yeah, but there's a long way to go, I think, but the messages need to get out there and we can always say, oh, you know, know, they're not listening to the people, to the builders on the ground. I'm like, well, how do we just get a collective voice and saying, all right, these are the key things, and industry bodies, I guess, are meant to be doing that.

Duayne: 36:27

But yeah, it's got to come from, you know, from the mouths of builders, in a sense there's too many people mate with their that are sitting on boards that are only focused on lining their back pockets. Yeah it, it's true. As much as they say they don't want to like so many of our associations, they're all the people on the boards. Aren't the small mum and dad businesses, the builders that got the nail bag on every day. They're CEOs or general managers of volume building companies, tier one companies. Again, that's why we need to separate like why? Yeah, just yeah, seriously, it makes my blood boil. But, um, how do you see it working.

Peter: 37:09

How, how would? How would they?

Duayne: 37:11

just different sort of regulation for each part of the industry, or I just say it needs to be two completely different setups like licensing everything.

Peter: 37:21

Yeah, okay.

Duayne: 37:24

You're either a volume builder gets a volume building license, a tier one builder gets like. So at the moment there's only like in Queensland, there's only low-rise, medium-rise and open. I think that whole backwards system needs to be broken. A small builder that does custom work needs to be. All of us need to be down here on our own. And then the guys that do all the multi-rares and maybe shopping centres or commercial buildings and things, they need to be their own group.

Duayne: 38:02

And then the guys that do all the big high rise and all those types of things, they're their own group, because we're completely different business models. Yeah, like, absolutely like. Could not be any more different.

Peter: 38:14

It's so true. It's so true and that's actually this industry blueprint, because the eight people from the industry which are on there, who aren't from unions, they're all from different industry organizations but they've all got completely different agendas. You know, some of them are for the big infrastructure projects, but how can you compare that to? You know, building an architectural home?

Duayne: 38:35

yeah, it's just wild. Yeah, um, like, I think the most clear separation would literally just be homes, like if you're, if you're a home builder, you're in this group and then the only separation would be a volume builder and who knows, maybe volume builders would be in there. But actually it's probably that simple, now that we're actually talking about it, it probably is that simple. Like, literally, homes have their own division. Now that we're actually talking about like it probably is that simple. Like, literally, homes have their own division. Um, because it's complete, it's different construction, it's different locations, it's different requirements, like it's it's different budgets, like it just makes so much sense to separate it. Yeah, for sure. Um, and again, that's that is part of this mission that I'm on. Like, I want, I want to get in front of government people and I want them to understand how different our industry is, so that we can start to have that separation. I don't think it would. Well, I always think things are simpler than what they really are, but I think it's something we need to work towards.

Peter: 39:37

It doesn't have to be complicated. But you're right, you know, yeah, once it gets down to the people in a room, there's always agendas and things and why are we different?

Duayne: 39:46

like, why is every state different? Yeah, like now it's not only licensing different. Like now, with all these last um changes in the building code. Like now you've got states pushing back on changes in the building code, so now we like we don't even have an australia-wide building code with the ncc in some states, just like nah.

Duayne: 40:05

We won't bother with that for a while yeah, like it's just insane how this industry operates. And look, I think, look, if anything that's um, this mission that I'm on to create a new building industry, like that. I'm going down that path because I sort of like stuff it Like if these, if all the association, industry bodies, government, aren't going to listen, like let's just do it. And it's growing Like we're definitely gaining momentum, we're getting a lot of people behind us. This event. I'm I'm very nervous to see if this event works Like. I hope everyone gets behind me, I hope everyone shows up because, like one thing I can guarantee is, whoever comes, I will be making sure that they leave there a different person believing in themselves, believing in their business, believing in this.

Peter: 40:53

We are creating a new industry yeah, just looking at the lineup and what you've got there, it's going to be a great event. I've put together quite a few with GJ's and we'd have 500 or so people along to international conferences and, yeah, we would try and bring in speakers from all over the place, but that's just one of the best I've ever seen the line up you've got coming is awesome.

Duayne: 41:16

It's going to be great cheers. I appreciate that. Oh look, it's my wife's nervous because there's a lot on the line.

Duayne: 41:25

We've got to get bums on seats. I'm pretty confident we will. I think the industry it's time for change. I think a lot of people are realizing that there's better ways to do things. I think the other big thing that is happening is builders are the industry is realizing that we need to talk, um, we all need to work together. There's no bloody I don't know what's the word where everyone's uh like price fixing and shit what's our collusion, collusion.

Peter: 41:56

There's no collusion but, yeah it's just getting builders to work together, talk together it's got to happen and they don't talk enough, and that's, and yeah, that's what we found as well. You know, if you're not a part of a community like live, life, build or a franchise group or whatever, you know, builders aren't talking to each other at all. Yeah, and there's, there's a lot of issues and look that they should be talking about. Yeah, well, and there's no real like I guess there's a master bills and that they should be talking about.

Duayne: 42:19

Well, and there's no real. I guess there's the master builders and things, but you get the electricians they do it really well. They've got their body that really supports them. Plumbers have an association as well, but I'm not sure on the others plasterers and concreters and bits and pieces, carpenters but if those trades can do it, why can't builders do it? And not only that if there is associations for the different trades and groups, we all need to talk together, because that's the only way this industry is going to change. If it's everyone sort of collaborating and talking to each other, and actually, at the end of the day, the number one thing should be that we're all on a mission to give the clients what they deserve. Yeah, like because we none of us have jobs without clients. Yeah, and let's face it, there's a shitload of houses that need to be built. Yeah, 100.

Peter: 43:13

No, it's interesting around that builder trade relationship because after talking to builders reason, they're saying that covet era fractured a lot of those relationships. You know, you know trades. I thought they had loyalty from all of a sudden just took up and left and took a higher dollar, uh, supplies run out of material and then they couldn't supply and then all of a sudden the relationships in the industry just broke down and it's taking time to kind of rebuild and yeah, yeah. So we're keen to run some events, even with suppliers and builders on a panel and say, hey, what do you expect of me, what do you expect of me? And just get it out and have it out on stage. And, yeah, try to have raise those conversations because it's yeah, it's critical, I think, just to just have the frank conversation.

Duayne: 43:58

Yeah, so, mate, what are you going to be doing at my event? What's? What are you doing?

Peter: 44:04

there we're tossing a few ideas around, yeah, and it might be, um, but ultimately we want to get builders, we want to hear their thoughts on what makes a good builder, uh, what they think the expectations should be on builders, and we'll throw in a few maybe controversial questions around the industry and uh, yeah, what, what? Um, so we're going to do that get suppliers and do the same thing and same with trades, right, so we just want to raise conversations with everyone, uh, and then also, I don't know, we'll try and bring in maybe a golf simulator or something.

Peter: 44:33

Mate, we'll try and bring in something, add a bit of excitement, yeah, a bit of competition, but no, yeah, we just want to get there and just start to build some conversation and build some community. So the whole idea of the Good Builder is just to build a community of builders, and yeah, that's what it is. There's a lot of different ones, but this has just been more general, broad industry community of builders who want to see things done better.

Duayne: 44:58

Yeah, I, industry community of builders who want to see things done better, and yeah, I think it's fantastic. So we're giving the guys some space at the event where, uh, they're going to set up a little bit of booth, going to have a bit of fun. So if you come along to the event, make sure you go and find the guys. Um, you'll, I'm assuming you're going to have a bit of a crew there doing some filming and stuff.

Duayne: 45:12

Yeah, yeah, so um make sure you go, and find the guys and, yeah, give them some feedback, go and have a chat. Yeah, please do. Please do the um. I'm pretty keen to see the stories that come out of it. I'm like we're gonna. There's actually, um, I don't know if I should have should be allowing it or not, because it's my event, but, um, there is so many people that are bringing their own film crews really, so, um, I'm like this is now that I'm now that it's like ended up so many.

Duayne: 45:38

I'm like yeah well, maybe should we, maybe we shouldn't allow that it's ended up so many. I'm like maybe we shouldn't have allowed that. It's all our content.

Peter: 45:41

It's going to be huge. It's going to be everywhere.

Duayne: 45:44

Yeah, and that's the way I think of it. The more people that come, the more people that film the day, the more people that put it out there. It's just adding to the creating the new industry. Good on you. I'm really keen to see and it's all different, different people like we've got some suppliers that are, um, that don't normally take their marketing team to an event. They're bringing their team. We've got builders that do a lot of social media that would normally go to an event on their own are bringing their team. So, um, yeah, look, hopefully that doesn't scare people off. It's not going to be a day where you're just going to have cameras in your face everywhere, but I guess for me, it's very exciting to know that people are that interested that they want to capture it.

Peter: 46:22

Yeah, that's it, that's it and yeah, that's here what builders have to say yeah, yeah, for us it's just if you've got a piece you want to share, if there's something you're passionate about, yeah, let's share it. We'll put it out in conjunction with the day and just get a whole yeah with the day and just get a whole.

Duayne: 46:38

Yeah, We'll have to work on Matt Rising mate, We'll have to get him sitting in your chair. Oh, that'd be good mate, See what he's got to say.

Peter: 46:44

No it's great. Yeah, we're really keen to support it, dwayne, and yeah, mate, I'm looking forward to it. Get it out there, yeah.

Duayne: 46:52

No, mate, look, we'll wrap it up. I really appreciate your and sharing your story. I think that says a lot about the type of person you are and definitely what you're trying to do for the industry. So look, guys and girls, get behind the guys at Good Builder, go and check them out. What Instagram, what website.

Peter: 47:11

Thegoodbuildercomau.

Duayne: 47:13

Yeah, and LinkedIn. I see you smashing LinkedIn, yeah.

Peter: 47:18

If anyone's on LinkedIn, we're all over it, probably too much.

Duayne: 47:25

It can never be too much. Go and check them out, get behind them, because they are honestly. I'm not just pulling your toe, mate, but the articles you're putting out are articles that the industry needs.

Duayne: 47:38

Yeah thanks mate, we shouldn't just be getting articles with just garbage and insolvencies and and builders that do the wrong thing, traders doing the wrong thing, like it's good to see some good quality I guess product out there. That's actually um spreading the word about how good the industry actually is if you push all that other shit to the side yeah it 100.

Peter: 47:59

Yeah, and one thing as well like we're always looking for builders to talk to, uh, if you have an opinion on something, let us know, get in touch. And uh, we want to hear from builders and get builders voices out there more. That's the whole point of it. Yeah, unreal mate.

Duayne: 48:12

Well, look, keep up the good work. Um, look, guys, reach out. If you, uh, if you've got any questions about anything or you've got a topic that you want us to talk about on the podcast, we'd love to hear it. Make sure you do the like, comment, share, all those types of things. But before I wrap up, make sure you get to the event, the Level Up event on the 30th of May 2025.

Duayne: 48:32

Look, if you are a tradie, if you're interesting in building work, healthy homes, building science, if you're interesting in building work, healthy homes, building science, if you've never heard the words building science and healthy homes, it is well worth get online, get on Google, do some homework, look into it, because this will be your opportunity to come to an event with the world leaders in these things. And, like I said, we're also going to be covering business development, personal development. You will leave this day a different person, believe me. If you implement what you learn on this day, not only will it change your business, it will change your life. I promise you that. So look forward to seeing you there Friday, the 30th of May, here in Brisbane. Go to my website, duanepiercecom. Grab your tickets now, because they are selling out fast. I'll see you there.

Peter: 49:23

Are you ready to build smarter, live better and enjoy life? Then head over to livelikebuildcom forward slash elevate.

Duayne: 49:32

To get started, everything discussed during the Level Up podcast with me, dwayne Pearce, is based solely on my own personal experiences and those experiences of my guests. The information, opinions and recommendations presented in this podcast are for general information only, and any reliance on the information provided in this podcast is done at your own risk. We recommend that you obtain your own professional advice in respect to the topics discussed during this podcast.