Why Australian Builders Should Use Anxiety As Their Superpower

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Anxiety gets thrown around a lot these days. But what if you've been looking at it all wrong?

In this episode, Duayne sits down with mindset coach and international baseball coach Aaron Applefield to break down what anxiety really is, why it might actually be your greatest superpower and how to use it to perform at your best.

If you've ever let nerves or self doubt hold you back from reaching your potential, this one's for you.

Timestamps:
0:00 - Introduction
2:15 - What Anxiety Really Is & Why The Word Is So Polluted
6:30 - The 1-9 Anxiety Scale & Finding Your Sweet Spot
10:45 - Using Anchors To Tap Into Your Best Performance
15:20 - Why Nerves Are Actually A Good Thing
22:00 - How To Deal With Anxiety In The Workplace & With Apprentices
32:00 - Panic Attacks & How To Bring Yourself Back To The Present
38:00 - The Power Of Rituals & Routines
48:00 - Common Things Builders Say About Anxiety
55:00 - What To Do When Anxiety Hits Hard
1:02:00 - What Level Up Means To Aaron Applefield

#builder #podcast #buildingconstruction #constructionbusiness #constructionindustry #mindset #anxiety #mentalhealth

Transcript

Welcome And Guest Catch Up

SPEAKER_01 1:28

G'day guys, welcome back to another cracking episode of Level Up. We are back in the shed today for a uh another awesome episode with a good mate of mine. I've known him for quite a while now. He uh he has added a lot of value to not only, I guess, my personal life over the years, but um definitely my business. Um, so a big warm welcome to Aaron Applefield. How are you, buddy?

SPEAKER_00 1:51

I'm fantastic. Thanks for having me. It's always the answer you get from me, right? Fantastic, outstanding.

SPEAKER_01 1:55

It is, mate. You're a very positive person. But uh, I guess just to go back a little bit, this is your third time, I think, on the podcast. Yes, it is. Um, to give people that maybe new listeners and stuff that haven't uh heard you before. So Aaron and I originally met because Aaron is or was our um our representative at our one of the hardware stores that we use up here in Brisbane. Um, and then over the years, Aaron's done lots of different things. Um, he's an international coach, he's um world-class baseball player. Give me a bit too much credit. Um still heavily involved. He's also a mindset coach, um, and through the mindset coaching, he is actually one of our mentors in my live life build training business for um for builders. So Aaron adds a lot of value to everyone that spends any time with Aaron. So um, but the main reason I got Aaron back today is we want to talk about anxiety. Um, Aaron's very good on the subject. We've recently done a Zoom call with our Live Life Build members about anxiety, but um, this podcast today is all about using your anxiety as your superpower, which um I'm gonna hand over to you now, mate, because I'm I'm really looking forward to this conversation and what you've got to add to this, I guess, uh yeah, this topic.

The Anxiety Scale That Helps

Anchors That Settle Your Nerves

SPEAKER_00 3:11

Hmm. It is a hot topic. Look, um, every day I come across conversations, whether it be at work with what I do at Brett's, I work in a people and culture space as our training and welfare coordinator and officer, and also with my business, Stoic Coaching. I coach professional athletes, young athletes, um, builders, young professionals, older professionals, work a lot with apprentices. Um, and then on top of that, you know, with the professional coaching that I do and working with the Brisbane Bandits, um, I spend a lot of time talking about performance. And obviously, um, with performance, uh, there's a care factor that comes to that. Um, so this is a very passionate topic of mine. Um, and I think one of the reasons why it's so passionate is how confusing it can be for people and how polluted uh the word has become. Um I do some studying in neurolinguistical programming um in LP, and I find it really, really valuable, especially when coaching. Um I use it myself, but one of the things that highlights to me is the language that we use. Um, so in that Zoom call, um, and as I was doing research for it, I stumbled upon um a book uh which was by uh Dr. David Rothsmarin. He's the leading uh anxiety expert, internationally known. Uh he wrote a book, and I'm terrible with remembering things, but he wrote a book called Thriving with Anxiety. Um, I listened to it on an audiobook and it was unbelievable. And then that delved me into watching a interview that Mel Robbins did with him that was phenomenal. Highly suggest anybody watch it. An hour of your life that will change your life forever. And probably where I'd like to start this conversation is one of the things that he points out is that on a scale of zero to ten with anxiety, uh, zero doesn't exist because uh it means you don't care and there must be something wrong with you if you don't care. Um at the regular extreme of the scale of 10, if you had that level anxiety, you'd you'd be dead. Um you just wouldn't be able to perform and do anything. So let's take a scale of one to nine, which is what he talks about. And I think it's a very easy way to understand it. One, two, and three is everyday feelings. Um and I think using the word anxiety there is probably mislabeled, in my opinion. I think that using words like um care or uncertain or excited, um, we get young athletes who go, and because the language they learn from their parents and their influences, they say, Oh, I'm really anxious or my anxiety is spiking with before the game. And I go, You mean you're excited? And when you get them to change their language, it changes their perspective. Hence neurolinguistical programming, it's the the language that we use internally as well as externally and how it influences us and other people. Um then you have the scale of let's go to the other side, seven, eight, and nine. That is clinical anxiety. That definitely has the label of anxiety, and you may need medication, but you definitely need professional help. That is not the space I work in. Um that is definitely the space that Dr. Rothmarin works in. Uh he is uh the professor at Harvard. But the sweet spot, in my opinion, is that four, five, and six. Um four, five, and six is where you can turn that into a fuel. You can turn that into a superpower. In fact, it's an interesting question that I've been asking a lot of people lately, whether I'm interviewing them or just in a chat, is what's your superpower? And we'll come back to that maybe at another stage. But in that four, five and six space, I truly believe that shifting your language by reframing how you view it, how you say it, can have a drastic impact on your outcomes. Also things like anchors through NLP. And anchor is the ability to um anchor down and tap back into a feeling of success, performance. And we use this with athletes all the time. Um, I think many times we've had conversations about walk-up songs in baseball. If you ever watch a professional baseball game or you go to a live game, every batter, when they come up to the plate, they choose their own walk-up song. Songs and music um have a great impact on us, and that can guide someone and take them back to those moments of success when they're in a performance situation. Um, so I carry an anchor with me everywhere I go. I carry um, my dad was a top gun pilot and instructor, and I carry his fighter pilot slider in my pocket. Um, the amount of times over the years, mate, I've seen you pull that out and move it around in your hand and especially on flights. In fact, I'll tell you a quick story. Coming back from Adelaide from the trip, uh, we boarded the plane late, 9 30. We're gonna get in at midnight. And as I boarded the plane, I looked down at the seat I was um given and it had ashtrays in it. And I looked at the hostess and said, How old is this plane? She says, Is it 30 plus years old? I went, Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 7:46

They must fly the old ones to Adelaide because we went to Adelaide recently, and yeah, seriously, it felt like we were going back in time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:53

And then the flight back, um, we flew through that storm on Sunday. So as we're coming in, um, you know, you hear the guy and he says, uh, you know, prepare the cabin for landing. And usually that's about 10, 15 minutes. After about 30 minutes, I'm going, what's going on? And he was silent. Um, and now it's where it's dark and there's lightning flashes and thunder, and he's the engines are ramping up and ramping down. And yeah, so it's obviously you're gonna be anxious, you're gonna be nervous. I have no control of that situation. I'm gonna see. So, yes, I was rubbing the lighter, I have a cross around my neck, and anchors I think are important whenever you're trying to tap in and trying to guide yourself through those difficult times.

SPEAKER_01 8:29

So, you just mentioned before, and uh I'm just thinking about what we were talking. Uh, like I know growing up, you never really heard the words anxious or anxiety, or like I I don't ever remember getting told by my parents that I was anxious. Um but I feel like now I I know when I'm getting anxious and I get a bit of anxiety, I get worked up about things. But back when I was growing up, I I got told I was nervous. Um like anxiety, like you said before, it's definitely one of those words that has become very polluted, it's thrown around all the time. Um I feel like people use it as a bit of an excuse sometimes. Like nerves are a good thing, yes. Like you need to lean into that shit.

Action Stops Anxiety From Growing

SPEAKER_00 9:19

Absolutely, and resilience. I mean, at the end of the day, the only way to move past anxiety is to take action. Look, I work in a mental health space and um we have lots of conversations around this, and it's the one area of mental health that I'm aware of that the only way to get through it is by going through it um and taking action. And I think I've used an analogy before that was shared with me about it's like a one-inch lake. You look out at this lake and you got to cross it and you go, oh my gosh, that's massive. Um, and how deep is it? And you take a step into it and it's one inch. Okay, you take another step and it's one inch, and you realize it's a one-inch lake, it's not as big. We tend to magnify and make things bigger than they need to be. Um, Mel Robbins talks about the fact that anxiety is in the future. Um a lot of times depression sits in the past, and the present moment is called the present because it's a gift. And if you have a heightened level of awareness and you live in the moment, then it's just about how do I make that next step in the moment. And that's something that I think is really important. Another person that I've I've started following recently, and I really enjoy um his approach is the everyday spy. And the everyday spy is um Andrew, and I'll mispronounce his last name, but bathista. But very interesting. He shared um that the CIA actually recruits people specifically who show signs of anxiety. And the reason for that is a heightened level of awareness. And they talk about the fact that that heightened level of awareness is the gift of fear. And the gift of fear can be an amazing motivator. Um, but they can train you to switch on that left side of your brain, the logical side of your brain quicker, but they don't want to ever lose that sense of awareness. And I think that that's a really special way of looking at it.

SPEAKER_01 11:05

Um one of the uh more recent episodes of um DOIO of a CEO, he talks to a CIA, an ex-CIA agent, and she talks about that, how that like you want they want that. Like they want to know that you're aware of your feelings and uh that you can manage that and again use it as a superpower.

Family Examples And Simple Checklists

SPEAKER_00 11:26

Look, we'll give the you know example. I wake up this morning, I know I've got this podcast to do, I've got a full work day ahead of me as well, and I've no idea what else is gonna get slipped into my day. If I woke up and I didn't feel some sense of uncertainty or um excitement or concern, there'd be something wrong with me. It would be my care factor, there's something wrong. I think that the the trick is is to lean into that and to have things that can support you that will give you the ability to work through those things. You know, um I remember laying in bed with my son one night and we were talking about rituals and routines and how they apply to sport and to life. Really cool conversation. And I was sharing with him before my language had changed, um, that that was an area of my life that I used those tools to reduce my feelings of anxiety. I try not to use that word as much anymore unless it's definitely that at that level. Um, and I'll never forget his head whipped to the left and he said, You've got anxiety. I said, Hudson, everybody on the planet has a level of anxiety. It's how you deal with that that really defines you. Um, so yeah, I have my rituals, I have my routines, I have the things that help me to get through those. And I think it's really powerful that if you have a level of awareness and you have a plan and an action plan, how you can get through those processes and like whatever it is.

SPEAKER_01 12:46

Yeah. And anxieties, like even uh in our family, like uh myself and my oldest daughter Lottie are very different to Camille and our youngest daughter, Violet. Like Camille and Violet get very anxious if if they don't know like there's not that uh if something happens that um like we if we're on a road triple something and like they they're all they get worked up thinking, oh shit, like we're like when when we first bought our camber trailer, uh like to me, I don't care what happens, I'll just pull up on the side of the road. Does not worry me one bit. But they get very anxious about oh shit, it's getting late in the day. Like, are we gonna make it to the next location? What if we get there and we haven't they haven't got a spot for us? What if? Yeah, like there's all these what ifs, and that makes them very anxious, which can often lead to uh them getting very stressed out, uh sort of making conversations that don't need to be uncomfortable, uncomfortable because they they get so worked up about it. Um where like I get a lot of inside I I get anxiety from challenging myself, and I I just I like leaning into it. And so and these days I I think I've done enough challenges and I've lent in it lent into it so much that I look for it. Like I want to find the next challenge that's gonna really draw like make my anxious anxiety get out of control so I can like can like push myself, can I get through this? Um and it's good because now like these days, like Camille and Violet uh sort of leaning more towards that as well. Like um, like if we to see how far uh Violet's come with her anxiety in the last two years is unbelievable. Um, but that was purely from working with her to find out what was giving her anxiety and then coming up with solutions. So, like even a simple one, like you talk about uh having routines and rituals will help you, and that's like a perfect example with Violet because even when we go to our farm, she loves going there, loves it, camping, riding the quad bike, like but like she'll ride the quad bike all day. But if we get to the farm and she hasn't checked the fuel, she like she'll start to get a bit of anxiety, like, oh what if I go riding the quad bike and I run out of fuel? Like, how will you know where I am? Like, so we've learned to overcome that by like she sort of knows now how long she can ride the bike for before it's getting low, and she knows that every couple of times she comes back to camp, like just take the fuel um lid off and check the fuel. So checklist, yeah, like just simple little things that have made an incredible difference. Like, she she got to a point where she wouldn't even go on the quad bike because she was so nervous and or so anxious about what if? What if I get stuck in the bush? What if you don't know where I am? What if something happens? What if what if I'm too far away and I can't get back at you? Like what if it doesn't? Yeah, yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_00 15:37

I look, I the word overthinker is something that I I struggle with because I am that person, but I've learned to use that as a superpower. The position that I played in sport as a catcher meant that you're constantly thinking about if this happens on this pitch, then I'm gonna do that. If the ball is hit here, I'm gonna do that. To me, that is a great thing. Other people, if they were going through that process, that would give them feelings of anxiousness. But for me, having a contingency plan and a contingency plan for the contingency plan, a backup plan for that, that gives me a sense of peace. I've ticked all those boxes, but there still could be an anomaly that comes up. But you have to learn how to pivot through those things. And that's where you know, taking the time to pause, assess the situation, and then take action. Where anxiety spikes and and gets worse is when we don't take action, when we sit in that moment and we it fasters.

SPEAKER_01 16:29

And I see that every day almost in, and you I'm sure you see it with the teams in in the businesses you work in as well, like with apprentices and um people on site, like they will put off doing something, like they'll drag their feet dawdling around over here because they work them out, work themselves up so much about doing something over here because they they feel like they what if they make a mistake, or what if they can't do it up to the tradies or my standard?

SPEAKER_00 16:55

And um like it's actually learn from it and you get better.

SPEAKER_01 16:59

Well, it's a big part of our uh weekly meetings now. Like I every weekly meeting now, like I talk about, like you will make mistakes. But we all make mistakes. Like the it I don't care if you make mistakes. If you make the same mistake five times, I'm I'm gonna get annoyed. But ever we all make mistakes. Every day's a school day. So don't let that anxiety of and that fear of you making a mistake or letting me down or letting the carpenter down or letting the client down hold you back. Just have a go.

SPEAKER_00 17:28

And the concern that you have for making that mistake and letting someone down, good. You should care about that. Yeah, it means you have a care factor. Apathy is probably the worst thing on the planet. You know, I don't get concerned about people that care, I get concerned about someone who shows no care factor at all. Yeah, that's the one that goes, uh oh.

Sponsor Message Highwood Timber

SPEAKER_01 17:46

Yeah, jumps in, doesn't know what they're doing, makes it all up, well, makes a lot of stuff up. So no stop doing. So, yeah, I I the biggest reason I wanted to get you on today, mate, and talk about this is I I see anxiety getting thrown around all the time, and I really believe it's holding so many people back. Like people aren't realizing their true potential because they're they're simply just waking up in the morning and letting the anxiety stop them from achieving things. All right, guys, I want to introduce you to a really exciting new product that I believe is going to play a massive role in Australia building healthier homes. As you all know, I am extremely passionate about healthy homes and I'm doing a lot of research and putting a lot of time and effort into making sure my construction business is leading the way when it comes to building healthy homes here in Australia. We've teamed up with the guys from Highwood Timber. Highwood Timber are pioneering condensation management with their high flow ventilated LVL batten system. High flow battons give builders a stronger, straighter, and smarter way to create a ventilated cavity behind cladding and underneath roofs without compromising on structural performance. While tackling condensation to improve building health and ease of insulation, highwood battons are built to perform. When it comes to dealing with condensation and ventilation, high flow battons will help you create continuous ventilated cavities behind all your cladding and underneath your roof sheeting. They reduce condensation risk and support healthier, longer lasting buildings. Highwood timber battons are also in alignment with the proposed NCC condensation management requirements as well as passive house ventilation requirements. Being an engineered LVL product, they are stronger, straighter, and more dimensionally stable than a solid material such as pine. This helps resist warping, twisting, and shrinkage, ensuring more consistent installs less prone to splitting than solid timber. Howwood timber batons are precisely manufactured, meaning that your installation will be faster and easier than other products on the market. The part that I like the most about these batons are they are H3 treated for long-term protection against decay and turmoiles. They use a waterborne H3 treatment which reduces reactivity with membranes and adhesives when compared to LOSP. These are the exact battens that you want to be using on your homes and your builds if you are considering building healthier homes or passive homes. Check them out. Highwood Timber Products.

Fear As Motivation Without Spiralling

SPEAKER_00 20:18

It was really neat. One of the calls I was making with a coaching call, a builder was very honest with me, and he said, um, my anxiety is now what pushes me to become better. I was like, that's so awesome, dude. Tell me more. And as he was explaining it to me, we talked about then again another Zoom that I'd done talking about motivation. And I've learned about myself that fear is a great motivator for me when I need to get through the grind. What happens if you don't, apples? You'll let the team down, um, you'll be lazy, you won't perform. That's not good. That pushes me to get my ass out of bed and get to training and do what I need to do to get the job done. I can't use that type of motivation before I step on the field to perform. That needs to be affirmation. You've done this a million times before. That needs to be those anchors that I talked about to send me back to those times that I've had success. There's different types of motivation for different types of times in our life. And anxiety can definitely be used as a superpower in that four, five, and six range. That one, two, and three means you care. That's normal, healthy feelings. Probably shouldn't even be labeled as anxiety. Four, five, and six, in my opinion, that is the sweet spot. Seven, eight, nine, you definitely need to get some help. So no doubt about it.

SPEAKER_01 21:33

Is that what you mean when you talk about channeling your anxiety uh to be more productive? 100%.

SPEAKER_00 21:39

If you go through the process and you take action, you'll learn from it. Regardless of the outcome, you will learn from it and it will become easier to do it the next time. Whether you call it um desensitization or inoculation, whatever you want to call it, by introducing yourself into situations that make you feel uncomfortable, will then in turn make you feel more comfortable doing that later. That's how we progress. I remember someone saying to me once in another coaching call, hey, Apple's finally, it's easy. And I went quiet on the phone. And I'm not usually quiet, as you know, I get a soapbox and I'll get going. And he said, Are you still there? And I went, Yeah, I'm just thinking about how I want to respond to you. And he goes, just spit it out, Apples. You got something to say, say it. I go, is that the goal? Is the goal for it to be easy? Because I don't understand that. For me, if my gym session gets easy, that means I'm gonna lift the weights, I'm gonna increase the reps to make it more difficult so that I can grow and be challenged and get better. I said, So I don't understand that. That doesn't make sense to me. When I pray or when I work towards something, it's to have greater capacity, not for it to get easy. And the funny thing is, as you work towards that greater capacity in life, it gets easier. But I never want it to be easy. It's kind of like if you're the smartest man in the room, you're in the wrong room.

The Trap Of Wanting It Easy

SPEAKER_01 22:50

You know, but like anxiety is not something that I think and look, I'm I'm even getting frustrated myself for using the word so much.

SPEAKER_00 22:57

Yeah, it's it's hard because it's become second nature.

SPEAKER_01 23:00

Well, again, it's just thrown around all the time. Like you hear it everywhere. Like, um, mate, I can't believe how much it gets thrown around at the girls' school. Like um Safe space. Seven and nine. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:10

Why do you need a safe space? Yeah, I I don't understand that. Like I want to be pushed and challenged and they get better. Yeah. If we create safe space, how do they ever get out of that safe space? Well, I've never thought about it like that. It's it's kind of like um participation awards. Uh a really huge pet peeve of mine.

SPEAKER_01 23:29

Don't get me started, but like you know what I mean? Everyone's everyone like this the world's created this thing where people feel like they're going to get out of this anxiety. They're going to get to a point where it is easy. But it it shouldn't get easy. Like if you get to a point where my my personal opinion is if you get to a point where you're not feeling anxiety, you've you've become comfortable. You've you've you're stale, you're stale.

SPEAKER_00 23:57

Diamonds are developed under pressure.

SPEAKER_01 24:00

Like in and is that where you want to be? Like, do you want to be in a position like that? Like I again, for me, anxiety, if we're gonna call it that, is what I lean into. Like if I'm not getting I'm gonna start calling it nervous because that's what it is. Like if I'm nervous about something You can say feelings of anxiousness.

SPEAKER_00 24:18

I mean that's not a level of anxiety. I mean, I think the language is important. It really is important in everything that we do. Look, whenever you how are you? Outstanding, great, fantastic. A lot of times I'll back that up at the end by saying some days it's easier to say than others. Today was an easy day to say it. Other days it's not so easy, but it's a choice. Everything in life comes down to choice. You do have a choice on how you respond to things. The situation you may not have a choice in. I didn't have a choice being on a 30-year-old plane in a storm with a team. You know, I was scared. I'm not gonna lie, I was scared. But I had the choice about how I handled that situation. So what do I do? I tap into some of my anchors, I reframe it. What can I do? Pray. Well, I can sit there and I can trust. I will tell you though, it would have been nice if the pilot had come on board the the PA and said, Hey, don't worry, I've been doing this for 40 years. I got you. You know, and if he had been standing at the door as we were exiting, like a lot of times there were, I would have said, mate, great pilot, but you need to work on your you know interpersonal communication skills.

SPEAKER_01 25:14

You might have been too busy trying to hang on the controls. Yeah, quite possibly, quite possibly. Let's give him a little bit of grace.

Apprentices Stress And Mislabeling

SPEAKER_00 25:19

I'm glad we landed. But yeah, it look, those feelings make us human, you know, feelings of excitement, feelings of joy, feelings of sadness. Lean into those feelings. When we shy away from how we feel, that's when it starts to compound. When we face it, as you said, it gives us a sense of strength because we're facing the obstacle that it's in our way.

SPEAKER_01 25:41

Mate, I've seen so many, like we've had some really, really talented, fantastic young people, um, apprentices in our business over the last sort of 10, 15 years. Uh knowing more, like I educating myself and knowing more about it now. And I know that like back 10, 15 years ago, I didn't really know what was going on with them. But the ones that have had it in the last sort of five or six years, it really breaks my heart that they can't see through the trees to get the other side of it. Uh, so many of them have not completed their apprenticeship or given up on their dreams because they've let what we call an anxiety completely control them. Like the amount of young people we've had that have worked themselves up so much that like we get you get a text message in the morning, oh I can't come to work today, I'm just not feeling up to it. Or um, and like when you have conversations with them, it's always because they're they're worried about like, am I gonna be able to do it correctly, or I don't know if I'm doing it right, or everyone's been too hard on me, or like it's um and I feel like it that situation's only gonna get worse and worse, and we're gonna see a lot more young people dropping out of trades and and the construction industry. I don't really know who the words for it, but like because we're we're almost allowing this to happen, like we're not giving them the tools, we're not talking to them about hey, like what brings this on? Like, can like what tools can we come up with to get you through this? So you want to come to work every day. Like, they're the sorts of conversations I'm starting to have with my team because I'm more aware of it now, so I'm trying to help them out.

SPEAKER_00 27:20

But well, look, I'll probably get myself in some trouble here, but when we when we have doctors that are diagnosing people in that one to six range as having anxiety, it's detrimental, in my opinion, because at the end of the day, they're starting to think, what's wrong with me? 100%. There's nothing wrong with you in that in that range. Again, if you're in that seven, eight, nine, you definitely need some clinical help. But if we're people are gonna start wondering, why am I labeled with this? Why am I feeling this way? You're feeling that way because you care. And if we give them, as you said, the tools to work through that, they're gonna excel. They're gonna learn how to be resilient, they're gonna learn how to perform. That's what we need in today's world. We don't need a whole bunch of people who are just sitting in their safe space, then who's going to win the battles? Who's gonna fight through the wars, who's gonna lead the charges? That's the concern, isn't it?

SPEAKER_01 28:12

100%. And then again, back to like saying it with the girls schooling, like they when Violet was going through all of her um her anxiety, it like it made her feel really uncomfortable because the school started labeling it. Yeah, and then because they're labeling it, they're like, Oh, she might need to be in a special group or she might need more, like this this special group will get more time to do their tests and things. And then she started saying to us, like, what why I don't have anything wrong with me like why am I special? Like, I'm not special. Like she got really upset about it. Like, it's Do you know how they deal with allergies now?

Panic Attacks And Grounding Tools

SPEAKER_00 28:47

Sorry, you know how they deal with allergies now? Because you know, I have a nut allergy. We've talked about this lots of times. Um when I was a kid, um, they would give you injections when you were allergic to things, right? Now they slowly introduce those things into your diet because what it is is your body going, that's bad for me, even though it's not. Um and you know, even with a nut allergy, the allergist that I met in Australia when my kids were having their allergy tests done, um, tested me as well. And he goes, you know, you could you could slowly start introducing nuts into your diet and this, that, and the other, but just make sure you're outside of an emergency room. I'm like, Yeah, no, I've lived without it my whole life, it'll be fine. But nowadays, whenever they introduce something like when my kids were diagnosed with a certain type of allergy, you slowly introduce that into their system. And then over time, the body builds up the knowledge to go, that's not something that I need to be worried about. That's not something that I need to attack. It's really interesting. Why we don't take that same approach towards anxiety um is exactly what needs to be done. Start stepping outside your comfort zones safely. And then over time, you can increase the level and increase the level, increase the level until it becomes no longer an issue. Let's talk about a panic attack for a second. You know what a panic attack is? Wow, how do you deal with a panic attack? I had a ball player um one time next to me during training and he was clearly going through panic attacks. I said, Are you okay? He goes, No, I'm having a panic attack. I said, Okay. The way that you go through that having done mental health first aid is that you bring them into the present. So the five senses, what can you hear? Can you can you hear the birds? Can you see the moon? Whatever. What can you touch? Can you feel this touch? And you what taste do you have in your mouth? What can you smell? As soon as you bring those five senses, they come into the present, all of a sudden it's amazing. A panic attack goes away. Same, same, right? You have to bring yourself into the present moment. And then Mel Robbins talks about the fact of counting down one to five or five to one, either way, and then taking action. Now, that action might be talking to someone that you're comfortable with about how you're feeling and putting yourself out there. That action might be taking a step towards what you're afraid of doing. But that is the key part of it is bring yourself into the moment in the present moment and then taking action. Once you've done that, you're no longer sitting in the future, you're sitting in the moment, and then you take action, and that's another moment, and then that's another moment, and then that's another moment.

Vulnerability Builds Real Leadership

SPEAKER_01 32:03

Yeah, it's powerful stuff. And I feel like people just taking ownership for it as well. I know I've seen a massive improvement in my team and my younger, younger guys by them knowing that I like I get nervous. I'm not perfect. Like there's things that um like I took two of my young apprentices up to the farm for a three-day weekend last weekend as a reward because they've really been putting in the effort and they've come a long way this year. So we had a big um boys' weekend up there and like shooting, hunting, fishing, cooking on the campfire, like did a lot of cool stuff. Um, one of them in particular had never really done any of that. Like he never held a gun, never shot anything, never hunted, never really cooked on an open fire. Like, there's just all weekend, it was just all these first. He's like, I've never done this, never done this, never done this. But um one of them in particular who is a little bit more out there and I think gets more or nervous and what he lets on. He uses like comedy to sort of uh break the situation down and make him feel comfortable and that type of thing. But uh two weeks ago we had a massive storm go through, and so I had a there was some fences down and needed some work to be done. So when we got up there, um one of them had never used a chainsaw, so I gave him taught him how to use a chainsaw and mate couldn't get him off it. He was on it for like three hours. He's like, What else can I cut? What else can I cut?

SPEAKER_00 33:29

Still got all those digits and limbs, you're all good.

SPEAKER_01 33:31

But we had to do some fencing, and a good mate of mine, Alistair, came up with me, and I bought these new wire strainers. Like I've I've done fence work before and whatever, but I've always uh like I either use a winch or depending on how tight I need to get the wire, like just different methods, and but I bought these hand strainers that I can use to pull the wire tighter, and I'd never used them before. And why I'm telling this story is I got them out, and Alice isn't a farm kid, like he's I don't know what he is, late 50s, he's done this shit his whole life. And I'm like, Oh Al, can you show me how I'm meant to use these? Like, I've never used them, and like one of my apprentices is like looking like fuck, Dwayne doesn't know how to do this, like what's what's wrong? Like, Dwayne knows how to do everything on site, he's and um he said something and it made me say to him, mate, I'm not perfect. Like, there's a lot of shit I don't know that I'm not afraid to ask. Yeah, um, and just that moment there like really proved to me that like you've got to be more open with people and let people understand um when you don't know what you're doing, because that gave I could see that instantly gave him a bit of relief.

SPEAKER_02 34:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:46

Um, and even just the last week being back on site after we'd been away, I've noticed a big change in how he's communicating and even just how he's talking to me. Uh, and I feel that's because he's seen that I'm normal, like I'm no different. I get inside as well, I get nervous about things. I was nervous, I didn't know how to use these strainers to pull the barbed wire tight, and I had to ask. Well, I asked if you're willing to take action, yeah. So I think there's a lot of ways that we can deal with this and that we can help people out.

SPEAKER_00 35:18

But one of the number one things I really think is putting your hand up, and there's so much power in being vulnerable, and it's difficult for that male bravado to do that. But once you learn how to do that, and and look, let's be honest, there's feelings of anxiousness about making yourself vulnerable, right? Yeah, but once you do that, you tend to realize that other people have similar feelings. We're not alone, we're not alone, but we tend to, as human beings, fall into the thinking that we are alone, and we create a lot of that ourselves, unfortunately. And you know, let's be honest, social media, phones, things of that nature, they're not helping.

SPEAKER_01 35:58

Oh mate, they are making it a lot, lot worse, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_00 36:01

I'm excited about the social media ban. I think it's fantastic.

SPEAKER_01 36:04

Well, we're I don't know where we're at with that.

SPEAKER_00 36:06

I don't really what yeah, it came into effect, I think it was two days ago. Something I that was um very apparent and was shared with me by someone was the amount of kids that you're now seeing that are out on the roads playing, riding bikes and whatnot. It's amazing. How good is that?

Routines That Create Stability

SPEAKER_01 36:20

Well, getting back to how it should have been, mate. Come home and the streetlights come on. Absolutely. Um, mate, we'll we'll move on. We did we touched on it a little bit before about um rich having rituals and routines. Like I know you're really big on this. You quite often talk about making the bed. Um, you you got me on to making the bed. So um talk to us a little bit about how um I guess finding a routine that suits you can really help with this nervousness and anxiety and stuff we're talking about.

SPEAKER_00 36:51

Yeah, interesting subject. Um you watch athletes and they tend to go through the same process all the time. That's a routine. Um, you watch um professionals and they'll have schedules set up for themselves about how they manage their day. That's a process and a routine. Structure is super important in life. The funny thing is, though, as I was talking about this with another coach, they said, How do you deal with it when there's something that comes up and you're not able to follow your routine or ritual? I go, Well, yeah, that does come up. I'll give the example of my lemons. I have a lemon every morning in a glass. First thing that hits my guts before I do anything, it helps alkaline my stomach. There are times that that's not possible or able to be done. The next thing in that process for me is about 30 minutes after that, I have three big glasses of water. So if I can't do the lemons, well, I go to what I can do. There's always something inside that ritual or that routine that I can do. No zero day. It's, you know. So at the end of the day, it can, everything in life can be reframed into being a superpower or something that works. But it can also be if you get too far down that rabbit hole and you get locked into, I must do this, then as soon as an anomaly comes in place, it can have a reverse effect. So it's important that you understand that a ritual and routine is a very powerful thing that can keep you on track and keep you focused. But the ability to pivot from that when it maybe isn't available or possible to be done doesn't mean that the entire thing needs to go away. Just because one piece isn't there doesn't mean that you can't follow the other processes to get the same outcome. And that's a mindset shift.

SPEAKER_01 38:24

Yeah. A routine's gonna be different for everybody. Like I am I definitely uh put my hand up with this one. Like I routines have changed my life. Like just um, like I don't use an alarm clock. Like I get whenever I wake up, I'm I'm up. The um combining routines with I don't I couldn't even tell you how long ago I listened to uh Mel Robin's five second rule when it first came out, like that 5-4-3-2-1 definitely played a big part in uh some changes in my life. But yeah, like getting up every morning, playing with a dog, I'm I'm the same. Have three or four big glasses of water, like smash out a workout, whether it's 10 minutes or 40 minutes, depending on the morning. Um I talked about this with um some Live Life Build uh members on a Zoom call the other day. Like another really important part of my uh morning routine, which I don't know, just gives me some comfort or makes me feel complete in the mornings, is I'll never leave the house without uh telling my family that I love them and have a great day. Like do whatever you gotta do, get get it done. Like that's a non-negotiable. Yeah, and so I was telling um on my Zoom call, I was saying, like, even if like if they're asleep, I'll write it, I'll write the exact same thing I would have told them on a note and I'll leave it on the kitchen bench. But like just those sorts of things give me comfort in my anxiety, knowing that I've set myself up for the day and I walk out the door knowing that I'm happy, I'm pumped up, like let's go get it. Um, so I think routines, it's it's really important to understand that routines are different for every single person. You've got to find what works for you.

SPEAKER_00 40:03

Absolutely, trial and error. You know, I'm a I'm a I'm someone who fasts and changed my life when I started to fast. And I do the 16-8. Um, I because of sport and you know, you play late at night and train late at night, I I wouldn't be able to fast in the evenings. It has to be fasting in the mornings. But when we travel um with the team, you know, you always have breakfast um at the hotel, and that's really the main meal that's provided. Yes, there's lunch and dinner that's provided before the games, but if I had to wait until one o'clock, I wouldn't have fuel to throw batting practice and train the guys and do all that to prepare for the game. So my routine gets a little bit out of whack. I've had to learn to accept that. So those five weeks of the year where I'm traveling, um, I've noticed that I put on about a kilo each time I come out back from a road trip. And it takes me three or four days to shed that kilo. And then I've got a week where it's not, but I'm gone back into my fasting routine. I think the main thing is to realize that there are times that you're not going to be able to follow it, but whenever you possibly can, do so because the outcomes that you'll get will be more consistent. But that doesn't mean that if a piece of the puzzle isn't there, it doesn't mean that you can't do the rest of your rituals and routines, your anchors, your mindset shifts, your your reframing in order to get those outcomes.

SPEAKER_02 41:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:23

The what you don't want to do is fall into the habit of letting those things go. So I make a point that as soon as I come back, I'm right back into my routines.

SPEAKER_01 41:32

Yeah.

unknown 41:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:33

Look, I guess for anyone that's listening that doesn't have a routine, like get on board with it. It's it's massive. Don't that don't overcomplicate it. Like, start off with one, two, three things. Like it doesn't have to be a big list of things.

SPEAKER_00 41:46

You'll hear tons of of professional motivators talk about it's not the the the space is not in being dedicated, it's in being consistent. If you're consistent, the dedication flows through. Yeah, it really does. The outcomes just happen.

Coaching Patterns Language Then Action

SPEAKER_01 42:02

Yeah. Mate, what's some of the things like you you're doing quite a bit of coaching, um like mindset coaching now, leadership type type coaching. Like you've mentioned you've had a few some calls with a few builders and people in the industry. What are what's some of the common things that people are talking about, I guess, when it comes to anxiety?

SPEAKER_00 42:22

I think I think it's the language is the biggest thing, is as soon as I can get them to understand the language that they're using and pivot and shift the language that they're using both internally and externally, all of a sudden it starts to make sense and they can start to feel the momentum as it comes. And I think that the big thing is is again, we're gonna say taking action. Instead of sitting in it, um, as soon as you take action, like that builder that shared with me, he uses that as fuel. And by doing so, he's seen incredible outcomes come from what he does. Because what happens is that he said, if I leave something and then I leave it and then I leave it, it just builds and compounds. And that just makes my feelings of anxiousness worse. Whereas if I take a small chunk and I just attack it one at a time, you know, it it becomes an easier process. And again, that desensitization, you become more resilient and you become more ability to get through those difficult times. And then, like anything, just because it's a different situation, you've had success getting through those tough times. My brother shared with me something when I was going through a hard time once, and he said, Um, apples, so far your success rate of getting through difficult times is 100%. That's pretty fucking good. It's so simple. Sounds patronizing, but when you think about it, it is so true. You know, we will get through this. Um I was on the cycle the other day and there was a monk that was talking about um the present moment. And he it was really good the way he articulated. And I won't do it as well as he did, but essentially what he said is he said the the time that you're in, the day is all you have. The day that's past is dead, it's gone. The day in the future hasn't been born yet. This day is all you have. Makes it so powerful and so easy because when you think about that, why would you waste that day? Why would you waste a moment sitting in your pain, sitting in your feelings of anxiousness, wondering what if if you take action in that moment, all of a sudden you have a sense of freedom and you do have a choice, you can control that.

Medication Mindset And Better Support

SPEAKER_01 44:35

Yeah, that's that's awesome, and that sort of mindset will definitely help people change their lives. Yep. Um I agree a hundred percent with what you said before, and it ties in with what you just said then, like the whole social media thing, like people will waste waste so much time during their day getting so caught up in what someone has someone else has posted or what they've said, what they've heard, um, instead of focusing on how they can make their day get better or end well. Um like I I don't like there's a lot of days that don't start well, um but it's how you deal with those moments and turn them around to make sure that every day ends well. Absolutely. Um so yeah, I but I think this is such a powerful topic and it's something that needs to be talked about more. I look, I'm a big believer that the world's got agendas and things get thrown around and pharmaceutical companies run a lot of what happens out there, but like I I really dislike that it's so easy to go now and just get a prescription and be given something to help you get out of something that is really just part of life.

SPEAKER_00 45:54

Yeah, and and the goal should be to not need it, right? I mean the goal a good coach, like let's say a player or a kid comes to me and says, I want some hitting lessons. Sure, no problems. We set goals, we set targets, we set things underneath those goals that will help you achieve them. We work through, we talk about things like mechanics and whatnot. But my goal is for them to not need me every week. If you're if you're seeing a coach every single week, for example. Years and years, or you're seeing a doctor for the same thing for years and years. You should probably start questioning what am I getting out of this. The goal should be, uh, you know, from from from my opinion, let's take a physios um point of view or an exercise physiologist. The goal should be to get the person healthy so they don't have to keep coming back to the physio. It shouldn't be to keep having them booked so that you can make money. Right? So, my goal whenever I'm coaching someone is my goal is that you won't need me every month or every week. That it would just be an occasional check-in. How are things going? Put them back on track and let them go. Not I want to keep picking up a paycheck from you.

SPEAKER_01 46:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 46:58

I'm not interested in that.

SPEAKER_01 46:59

100%, mate. The the best, the best coaches and uh teachers out or uh I think the best uh like everything, doctors, chiropractors, those types of things are the ones that you go to, you feel great, and they say come back when you need me. Yes, absolutely. Like, not hey, let's book in again next week and the next week and the next week. 100% all I've been to ones over the years, mate, went back in the day when I wasn't as open-minded on things like um let's get you booked in every week for the next six weeks and then see how you're feeling.

SPEAKER_00 47:29

Like yeah, wow. I I start questioning um, you know, the outcome, you know, where's where's the end?

Legacy Community And Perspective

SPEAKER_01 47:36

Yeah, yeah. Um mate, so where like what's happening with Aaron Applefield? Like, you got a lot going on.

SPEAKER_00 47:44

You um Yeah, my capacity is being stretched, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's uh fun times, fun times. Um I uh I love the opportunities that are presented in front of me. And I had a a chat with my boy the other day because he helped a player on a path to get back to where he wanted to be. And it was so interesting because that player was actually is actually his coach. And I pulled my son aside and I said, I'm so proud of you for you encouraging, motivating, and giving your coach, who is also an athlete, a viewpoint on. He asked him, Well, why would you give up on your dream? Why wouldn't you try again? Why wouldn't you keep chasing? I said, let's never doubt the impact and the influence that you can have on people, both positively and negatively. Be aware. So for me, it's just I want to I want to touch and and encourage as many people as I possibly can. Um on my wrist, I wear a watch, a lot of people wear a watch, but I also have an infinity little bracelet on my wrist. And it sits underneath my watch and next to it instead of in my other hand because it reminds me that although time um has a timeline and it will end, the ability for me to leave a legacy and an impact for a long period of time, infinite, um, with somebody that will say, Hey, I once had this coach Abels, and hey, I once had this guy who taught me about this thing. He said, And it might not even be my name that comes up. It's not about me and my ego, it's about whatever I was able to do to give someone some perspective on something that was different than they had before. And again, that language, right? Perception versus perspective. So many of us sit inside of our perception and we don't truly understand the difference between those two words.

SPEAKER_01 49:29

Yeah, well, mate, that's a whole other podcast. You've done you've done a session on that in Leafside Field as well. Um it's all mindset shifts.

SPEAKER_00 49:36

And it doesn't, you know, I mentioned to you that I've been approached at work about taking on another role. I think this might be 12 inside my just turned over 20 years. Um, and my I had a conversation. Sorry, sorry about it, mate.

SPEAKER_01 49:49

What do you get for 20 years these days?

SPEAKER_00 49:51

Uh I got a cap, I got a lovely card and a couple of green notes from my boss, which was lovely. Yeah, but to me, the most impact that it was um was what he wrote in the card. Yeah, that meant the world to me, just to be recognized. I don't like attention, but I love recognition. There's a big difference between the two. Um, the spotlight is not something that I really enjoy. I love being a support guy. Um, I don't like being uh a top manager. I like being amongst the troops, I like being a leader. I really enjoy that process. Um where were we going with that?

SPEAKER_01 50:28

I I batted into asked you what you uh got at 20 years, but oh I know, remember?

SPEAKER_00 50:33

They wanted to help give me a little bit of a role change. And I I rang my brother. My brother has uh his superpower is perspective, unbelievable ability to see things differently than other people and change your own perception through the perspective that he's giving you. And it's it was remarkable because I rang him immediately and I said, This is what's going on. And he goes, Huh. What a great opportunity. Yes, you'll be going back into sales, and although you're good at it, you don't necessarily like it anymore. He goes, but how were you successful as a salesperson? I said, I didn't sell. And he goes, interesting, tell me more. And I was like, Okay. I bring my coaching personality to everything that I do. In my core, and we had a conversation about this once before, that everyone has a center. My center is being a coach. I love it, I'm passionate about it. I could never be a counselor and I could never be a psychologist because I have a low emotional empathy chip, but I have a call, high cognitive empathy chip, which means that I will sit with you long enough to understand your situation that I'm like, what are we gonna do about it? What action are we gonna take? Let's put a plan in place. That's who I am. So he said, interesting. So the approach that you took when you were in sales was one of a coach. Tell me more about that. I said, Oh, well, I'm a relationship guy, I'm a service guy, and I would try and guide them about how things could benefit their business model and them, and I would learn more about them and their family and their business and whatnot. He goes, Great. So you bring who you are to what you do. So what does it matter what the title is or what the role is? Just keep doing that, keep influencing. Thank you, Eric. I really appreciate that. Even mindset coaches need people to lean on, but that only happened to come full circle in our conversation because I had the vulnerability to call my older brother and say, This is what's going on. When you put it out there, you'll find that there are people and resources around you that want you to succeed. And if they don't want you to succeed, they shouldn't be in your circle.

SPEAKER_01 52:26

Um, I only just did a uh video on that on my Instagram yesterday. Like you've got to find your community. Absolutely. Your community, like you can attest to this. Like, that's why Live Life Builds so successful. Like our community is unbelievable.

SPEAKER_00 52:39

That's um the awareness level inside of it and the ability for them to feel comfortable being vulnerable, but also comfortable being uncomfortable. And when you get comfortable being uncomfortable, it becomes something that doesn't create anxiousness inside of you. You see it as an opportunity to grow, an opportunity to get better, an opportunity to learn something new.

SPEAKER_02 53:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 53:02

What is it that um the stoic mindset is? Is uh once you think you know everything, you know everything you'll ever know. Right? So simple, yeah, and so true.

SPEAKER_01 53:12

Mate, we'll um we'll wrap it up shortly, but just do we have to?

SPEAKER_00 53:16

No, I can sit here for hours and talk to you. I love it.

SPEAKER_01 53:19

I know we have some very we've had some, yeah. You've definitely added a huge amount of A to my life over the like what are we you've been at Brett's 20 years. What have I known? You're 15.

SPEAKER_00 53:29

15, yeah. 16. Because the first five was um in a different role than when I moved into account management.

SPEAKER_01 53:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 53:34

Um but you wouldn't have wanted me selling to you because I don't know what I'm talking about when it comes to product, you know more than I do. You just wanted someone to service.

SPEAKER_01 53:43

What you just said makes perfect sense, mate. Like we you are the best you were when you were dealing with us, um, the best rep that we had ever had, because you even though you didn't always know about the product that we're we were inquiring about or getting pricing or whatever, you went out of your way to understand it, to learn more, to find out what we needed to find out and talk to whoever needed to be talked to, so that you come back to me with the with what I needed to know.

SPEAKER_00 54:08

Australians love it when a Yank says, I don't know, but I'll find out and get back to you. As long as you do, they'll respect that. To be honest, the amount of times that I would know the answer to something, I would never do this to you. The amount of times that I would know the answer to something, but I'd say, I'm not sure, that's a toughie. I'm gonna have to get back to you. By getting back to them, it adds value. It also makes them realize they don't know it, I don't know it. It it validates the fact that they don't understand instead of giving them the answer right away, quite often will make them feel like, oh, I should have known that. And that's not how you build a relationship with someone. So it's that awareness, it's having the awareness and and the perspective to read a room, read someone's situation, have that cognitive empathy to then be able to support them, help them without making them feel like they're deficient in any way. Because we all have something to add value. You know, another stoic principle is everyone is my master of something. I can learn something from everyone. Everyone has something that they do that's better than me.

SPEAKER_01 55:08

100%. Like we every day's a school day, and you should never think that someone's below you, higher than you, different to you. Like everyone adds value to your life if you let them.

SPEAKER_00 55:18

Yeah. But the real trick is, and this seems like an oxymoron, the real trick is that if if you're good at something, if you're a circle, be the best goddamn circle on the planet. Don't try and be a square and a rectangle and a triangle because society will try and make you try and change and be something that you're not. If it's important that you learn those skill sets, do that so that you understand them and you can be a little bit better. And if it needs that in your world, then sure, hone in on it, educate yourself, work hard at it. But the real key, as you said, is your community. Surround yourself by people who have different skill sets than you, but the same goal. Not everyone is a front rower in football, right? Not everyone is a pitcher. You need every position on a team all pulling for the same goal. Yeah. That's what it's all about.

Lean In Then Take A Step

SPEAKER_01 56:03

Right? 100%. Um we got all sorts of people that listen to this podcast, and I guarantee that a lot of them are being told or feel like they've got anxiety. Um, what's, I guess, a couple of things that you would recommend they do to maybe get out of a if they're having a hard day or a hard week, to try and get them out of that situation where they're they're in at the moment?

SPEAKER_00 56:29

The first thing I'll say is I'll do what I haven't done in this entire podcast. I would lean into it. Lean forward. Lean into whatever you're feeling. You're feeling it for a reason. Don't avoid it. The worst thing you can possibly do when it comes to feelings of anxiousness is to try and avoid it. There is no avoiding it. It will compound, it will always sit there in the back of your brain, it will eat at you. But, and obviously, I'm not talking about the 7-8-9, that's where you need to go and get some help. But if you lean into it, show some courage, take that step into that one-inch lake, I guarantee you you will get something out of it. You will learn from it. It might not happen overnight, but if you're committed to it and you're dedicated, you will get through it. Because so far your success rate of getting through difficult times is 100%.

SPEAKER_01 57:17

We're gonna have to wrap it up on that because that was that was gold. Very last thing, what does level up mean to you, mate?

SPEAKER_00 57:25

I think level up to me means that you're always trying to get to that next level. That you're never we've talked about this before. There is a difference between being content and being satisfied. You know, that pushing back from the table when you've had enough at dinner, you've had a beautiful meal, that's that's content. I always want to live my life in a world of gratitude and contentment and expressing that to those around me. But I never want to be satisfied. I always want to push and strive for more. And I think that that is healthy, and I feel like that's what winners do.

What Level Up Means

SPEAKER_01 58:06

Well, you're definitely a winner, mate. Like no doubt about it. A lot of participation. We're all winners here, not that kind, right? No, I'm definitely not that kind, mate. You won't you definitely won't get that kind of with uh level up. But mate, look, I appreciate everything that you do for myself. I definitely appreciate everything you do within uh Live Life Build and it'll elevate community. Um, I know our members just absolutely adore you. Like when we have our events and stuff, like you're you're the man. So um give me a soapbox and I'll stand on it, mate. Keep up the work that you're doing. Um, I love that you're really getting into your your one-on-one coaching. I I think that's fantastic because you were you're just so good at it. So uh and appreciate you coming on here today, mate, and and sharing your knowledge.

SPEAKER_00 58:47

So I appreciate the opportunity and the opportunity, if it was possible to influence or change one person's mindset who listens to that. I'm incredibly grateful for the opportunity to do that because we all need support and we all need help and we all need our community, as you said, but we all need to be pushed.

SPEAKER_01 59:03

Yeah, 100%. Jeez, mate. That just made it hard to wrap up because we could have a whole other conversation about pushing. But we'll bring you number four. That's um look at time.

SPEAKER_00 59:13

I'm your Huckleberry, guys.

SPEAKER_01 59:16

Look, thanks very much for listening or watching. Um, make sure you like, subscribe, share all those things. Tell uh the rest of the construction industry about this. If you've got questions, make sure you shoot them through. We're happy to answer them. If you want to come on the podcast and tell your story, we'd love to have you on here. Um go to the DuanePears.com website, make sure you grab your level up merchandise so that you can help us continue this level up movement to create a new building industry. Look forward to seeing you on the next one.